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Tony_O
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #125 on: Sep 26th, 2007, 10:24pm »
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on Sep 26th, 2007, 8:33pm, Philly wrote:
I think insults can be fun when done in a playful manner and when the insulter knows the insultee is going to get a chuckle out of it (i.e., most smack talk within a fantasy league). When insults are done with the intent to make someone else feel bad (and, in turn, make the insulter feel superior in some way to the insultee), then they're unnecessary and irresponsible and only beget more insults and more mean-spirited behavior. That's not the type of person I'm interested in being. How about you?  

 
 
Just my uninvited . Have a great day!

 
I agree! I try to not be that type of person as well.  
 
Now shut your pie hole!!  
 
That line will never stop being funny to me now!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #126 on: Sep 27th, 2007, 4:08am »
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Well,... as usual, as the goes on (I've seen this move before), old "BAD GUY" Steg is going to fight the good fight and try to make sure the deeper, more "self-challenging" points don't get lost in the shuffle of platitudes, pleasantries and enablers...
 
on Sep 26th, 2007, 8:33pm, Philly wrote:
I think insults can be fun when done in a playful manner and when the insulter knows the insultee is going to get a chuckle out of it (i.e., most smack talk within a fantasy league). When insults are done with the intent to make someone else feel bad (and, in turn, make the insulter feel superior in some way to the insultee), then they're unnecessary and irresponsible and only beget more insults and more mean-spirited behavior. That's not the type of person I'm interested in being. How about you?  

 
 
Just my uninvited . Have a great day!

 
This is a nice, general way of putting it, but once you start dissecting it and thinking it through, it (quite literally) doesn't get you all too far... if you want to live the examined life, the only one worth living according to good old Socrates.  It WAY OVERsimplifies things.  With ALL DUE respect, Phil, you haven't communicated anything here that I didn't in my post... with quite a bit more depth and substance, mind you.  You closed it with this tag about "That's not the type of person I'm interested in being.  How about you?"  That is such a LOADED statement and question.  There are LOTS of ways to be "the type of person I'm not interested in being", i.e. an asshole, in life.  All that we're dealing with here is intentional insults.  That's just the tip of the Titanic-sinking iceberg,... and, mind you,... one that does NOT really even apply to this situation.
 
What do I mean by that?  Tony SURELY did NOT intend his lead-in to his Week 2 report to be insulting.  Whatever I think of him, I do NOT think that of him.  So, what about "untargeted" insults?  Rush Limbaugh, Jimmy "the Greek", Don Imus, et al., did not intend to insult anybody or hurt anybody's feelings or, at least, that's what I believe or, at least, what they'd say.  What about when a return insult is, upon very thorough consideration, being used to teach a lesson [because addressing it directly isn't getting the job done, and is just either 1) creating further "mindless" acrimony if it's too done hardcore or, 2) if it's too done too softly, generally and/or vaguely (like I take your commentary to be, Jeff), further "enabling" the guy]?  There, the insult is TOTALLY intentional.  Of course, the intention of the intended insult isn't just to insult.  Now, we've got intentions on top of intentions to consider.  What about when you're in a room of unreasonably thin-skinned people?  What about my just typing "fuck" right now?  I'm sure someone was, at least, just a little offended by that.  But, I didn't mean to offend anybody. ...
 
The point isn't to try to answer these questions.  It's to see and come to appreciate the complexity of the issue at play here and not just knock down the guy in the crowd who's trying to deal with it on that more complex level it deserves.  Dealing with it at the level of complexity it deserves is what seeing the forest through the trees means, the trees being that knot of questions above.
 
Intentions, like expectations, are presumptions and, thus, dangerous waters.  But, of course, in life they are unavoidable.  They are not a legitimate excuse, though.  They can be a legitimate source of forgiveness.  But, on the proactive side of the ball, good intentions aren't enough.  I digress...  To wit, to tie this into another "philosophical" discussion we are having elsewhere on the boards, Michael Vick, I don't think, thought he was doing anything wrong.
 
It is more important to try to do your best to see the "bigger picture" (the forest), i.e. come at things from a more comprehensive, wholistic perspective, and, yet, also consider the person you want to be and the life you want to author, and, QUITE contrary to Phil's point,  what is ultimately most important is reasonably thorough consideration of the UNintended "residual" consequences of your actions.  That's the unselfish part.  What's intended is still "of the 'self'", so to speak.
 
Also important is execution.  I considered this in a recent private message, that portion of which I think is worth sharing here...
Quote:
That's the thing.  Intentions are only as good as the thought and "thoughtfulness" (of others) that goes into them. At the end of the day, it's all about execution.  In fact, "good" intentions + bad execution = a total mess because the provocateur has a loophole (viz. so-called "good" intentions) that justifies (at least in his mind) a defensive posture (and perhaps even a righteous attitude in the worst megalomaniacal of cases).  Meanwhile it is what it is, and we end up in a cycle of "mad"ness, so to speak.

 
That should do it for now...
 
Is any of it even going to be appreciated, no less sink in... ???
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #127 on: Sep 27th, 2007, 2:04pm »
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on Sep 27th, 2007, 4:08am, StegRock wrote:
This is a nice, general way of putting it, but once you start dissecting it and thinking it through, it (quite literally) doesn't get you all too far... if you want to live the examined life, the only one worth living according to good old Socrates.  It WAY OVERsimplifies things.
Socrates Schmocrates!    Good old Henry David Thoreau and I look at things similarly: Simplify, simplify, simplify!  
 
Quote:
Is any of it even going to be appreciated, no less sink in... ???
I appreciate your efforts, I just disagree with your methodology. I just feel that we'd probably accomplish more and resolve issues more quickly and avoid lingering bad feelings if things were done in a more aboveboard manner. I don't agree that using insults to teach a lesson is effective. Personally I'd be less interested in (intellectually) considering the lesson than I would be in (emotionally) considering the insult. I'd prefer that people react more intellectually than emotionally, but insults seem to automatically steer people to emotional responses instead of the more carefully considered intellectual ones. You and Tony have a history that dates back to when the QFL left the Gridiron, one which you've not forgotten as you brought it up again a while back, but still a long time after it happened. Are you sure that trading insults is going to resolve current issues between the two of you?
 
 
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What about when you're in a room of unreasonably thin-skinned people? What about my just typing "fuck" right now? I'm sure someone was, at least, just a little offended by that. But, I didn't mean to offend anybody. ...
Can you define "unreasonable"? Is there a baseline for reasonability? I happen to be one of those people who doesn't like the use of obscene (applying my own personal standards for what is obscene, of course) words like the one you mentioned above. Does the fact that it offends me make me unreasonably thin-skinned? I don't think I'm being unreasonable. I don't begrudge you the right to use it. I just choose not to use it myself. Does that make me reasonably thin-skinned? Maybe I'm not thin-skinned at all. Perhaps you're just unreasonably thick-skinned...?  
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #128 on: Sep 27th, 2007, 5:00pm »
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Awww, gee, Jeff...  This is hopeless...  I don't even have the energy to even try to begin unpacking that second paragraph.  So, I'm not going to. That's that for that.  But, I will say this much...  At this very juncture, bringing up that "other" old incident, which the last time I brought it up was about a YEAR ago, but, in any event, still is what it is, BUT hasn't come up as regards THIS, not even behind the scenes, mind you, gets us ABSOLUTELY NOWHERE.  In fact, it only CONFLATES things.
 
As for your third paragraph, your further questions just further prove the point I'm making here.
 
And, I know you probably know this, but since it's relevant...  Your depiction of Thoreauian (sp. ?) "simplicity" is WAY OVERsimplified.  One, as you say, "simplifies" things or, perhaps better put, focuses on the "simple" (the natural) so as to come to appreciate the complexity and see and appreciate that which we believe to be simple more deeply and "Thoreauly", to coin a term. He's not forwarding a philosophy of the simple-minded nor a philosophy of "K.I.S.S.",... quite the contrary.  His famous tale of the ants in Walden is not a "simple" story with a moral that can be encompassed by a one-liner.  It's a very "Thoreaugoing" (to coin another term ) story, detailing various facets of the "war" between the black and red ants.  It's a painstakingly complex tale.  The point is through seeing the complexity and mult-dimensionality in even the most simple of things around us, he wants us to cut out the bullshit, which only piles on further unnecessary complexities or, should I say, make for further unnecessary complications.  BUT, you really, truly, genuinely have to do the "legwork" it takes to accomplish/overcome the mental/intellectual challenge.  It took him, in his mind, many moons on Walden... in a MUCH less modern world. (Incidentally, if you are interested.  Thoreau is often used as a source of comparison with Daoism,... Walden - Dao De Jing.)
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #129 on: Sep 27th, 2007, 8:33pm »
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Any potential Junior Correspondent with sufficient interest to click on this thread will most likely run for his life if he reads through this argument. He would come here wanting to participate in a fantasy football related type of participation in this site. This type of thing will scare him away. And if potential Junior Correspondents who want to argue these subjects in this way are the only ones who need apply, expect things to dry up a whole lot.
 
I request that Referee move this discussion to a more appropriate thread in compliance with the rules and for the good of the site.
 
Edit:  I should have said respectfully request.  Steve has the right to determine how this site is run, and I also know that he is not a bully.  I just care enough to want potential new correspondents to understand that.
« Last Edit: Sep 27th, 2007, 8:46pm by Callie » Logged

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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #130 on: Sep 27th, 2007, 8:50pm »
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I second that motion Callie. You are right...this could be "fought" somewhere else.
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #131 on: Sep 27th, 2007, 9:27pm »
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Well, I see this a bit differently.  Better knowing things coming in than going out, and it's not like they're coming in droves, anyway.  In any event, there is NOTHING I have posted here that I do not stand by.  In fact, somewhat obviously, I consider my posts exemplary of the kind of dialogues I would like to see taking place here.  THAT SAID, if someone wants to respond to the "argument" portion of what's going on here, but would rather not do so on this thread, feel free to ("quote" from here if need be and) take it to "the Bleachers" thread.
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #132 on: Oct 8th, 2007, 10:53pm »
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I believe the point here is that Tony did not post a week one report.  Rather than apoligize he tries to act like he did it on purpose because it was foolish to try to predict week one.
   
As Steg rightly points out this is a slight to all the other correspondants who did actually post a week one report.
 
I agree with the old Stegger on this one!  
 
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #133 on: Apr 28th, 2008, 5:46am »
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Callie, I can't find where, if my memory is serving me correctly here, you volunteered to take over the Bears FF-specific Team Report again.  Am I right?  If so, does that still stand?  If it does, I'd like to get on that sooner than later (given the BIG move on the near horizon and the little Steglit on the way)!  Let me know, preferably right here, at your earliest possible convenience.  Thanks!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #134 on: Apr 28th, 2008, 5:00pm »
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Don't forget my offer to cover the Hate-riots...Err...The Patriots. Nobody better to cover them than the Steeler/Colt beat writer..
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #135 on: May 1st, 2008, 8:28am »
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on Apr 28th, 2008, 5:46am, StegRock wrote:
Callie, I can't find where, if my memory is serving me correctly here, you volunteered to take over the Bears FF-specific Team Report again. Am I right? If so, does that still stand? If it does, I'd like to get on that sooner than later (given the BIG move on the near horizon and the little Steglit on the way)! Let me know, preferably right here, at your earliest possible convenience. Thanks!

 
I just got back from weeks out of state.  (Mom had surgery and couldn't do anything.  I moved in and played slave.   )
 
Sure, I'll take the Bears report back.  It's one of the teams our family follows anyway.  
 
OTOH, if someone else wants it, no prob.
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #136 on: May 26th, 2008, 3:10pm »
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Callie, sk,... I hope you guys are still up for taking on the Bears and Patriots reports, respectively.  I will be making your pages today. If either of you have changed your mind, PLEASE let me know!  Otherwise, I am going... you are going... to be wasting my time here today, right?  And, you know I am not going to be happy about that, and justifiably so.  Anyway, thank you for volunteering and now for your anticipated consideration.
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #137 on: May 26th, 2008, 5:48pm »
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No change.   = Callie!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #138 on: May 26th, 2008, 8:25pm »
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go bro!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #139 on: May 30th, 2008, 2:57am »
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Callie, sk, your respective Bears and Patriots pages are up.  Your respective permissions are the same as for your other reports.  Thank you both for stepping up!
 
Also, Chuck, Tony, Eric, yous guys will be getting an e-mail regarding this, but, since I am here, I might as well double up on the communicae...  After one year of solid service to the site, you all's promotions to "Senior Correspondent" are official.  Your pages are up as well.  Congrats! (One... for each of yous!)  However, you will not be able to use them until we get that phone date out of the way and we get your permissions set up and I explain all the (knotty little) details you need to know to get going.  Let's get on that, preferably this upcoming weekend.  As I told yous, this in-service is actually not nearly as rough as was the one for the "Junior Correspondent" set-up.  Respond to the e-mail I am about to send yous about this a.s.a.p. and let's schedule this a.s.a.p. for a.s.a.p.!!!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #140 on: Jun 12th, 2008, 5:51am »
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Well, my fellow team correspondents, you have in all likelihood already noticed that the front-and-center links to the team reports have been removed from the pages of "the Gridiron" forum.  This finally had to be done (on a few different fronts).  The report pages are still there, however.  If you check for yours, you'll see so for yourself.  They're not going anywhere.  It is just that now they will function more so as your personal web page as opposed to an official feature of the site.
 
So, you may wonder, "What does this mean in terms of how we will all now go about making our reports?"  The content of the reports is to remain the same, i.e. FF-specific, and your goal during the season should still be to post a new report every week (though there is a "but" to that as you will see below).  What will change, slightly, is how we will go about announcing them to the community.  It's OUT with the "Analyses" pimp threads.  I now want us to announce/"pimp" our new reports simply via the "In-season" or "Offseason" team report threads (this, incidentally, may just conduce discussion of them,... which is part of the "bigger picture" modus operandi at play here... as you will see).  That's it!  Do note, though, that the links to the reports will remain in the rotating "Feature fader" on the index page of the forum.  They're rather innocuous there as I'm pretty sure very few pay attention to the fader.
 
This change certainly eases your commitment.  In fact, your commitment will now be more to yourself than me and the site.  The point is that everybody can relax a little bit for, at least, the '08 season.  Just do the best you can as you can.  Whatever gets done with these reports will be seen as bonus as opposed to how the FF-specific team reports in their current state are perceived,... which leads me to the final "reality check" here...
 
Guys, bottom line, our not having the whole league covered looks poor at this point.  When it was start-up, that was one thing.  But, for our "10-teams-short" reports section to take up center stage on "the Gridiron" is no longer advisable.  And, that is just the veneer.  When you scratch the surface and click into the reports section, you find a number (too high) of outdated reports, even during the season.  Forget about the offseason.  I myself am not doing a good job of leading by example (and I'm doing the best I can).  Compared to other FF sites out there, we are waaaaay behind.  That said, while we may be down, we are not out.  I hope that someday it all comes back the way it should.  Until then, you've got your personal team pages to have fun with as well as continue to prove yourself by way of.
 
Thing is, to get ourselves back untracked, we need to take a step back, and, philosophically, that is really what drives the scale-backs.  The aforementioned (very real, mind you) issues notwithstanding, what's happening with the FF-specific team reports section is really just a (more noticable) part of the general scale-back that is taking place.  It is to the "bigger picture" that I will now turn in a post on the "Offseason on 'the Gridiron'" thread...
 
http://www.fantasyfootballer.com/cgi-bin/theGridiron/YaBB.cgi?board=58;a ction=display;num=1042955464;start=125.
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #141 on: Sep 9th, 2008, 5:53pm »
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I would like to give a BIG THANK YOU to Rick Gould (Rams Correspondent), Ken Mesecher (Seahawks, Texans, Packers) and Eric Kiss (Saints) for, in this "time of troubles" or, at least, serious duress on "the Gridiron", keeping up with their team reports and posting 2008 Week 1 updates.  Awesome, job, gentlemen!  Also, a thumbs up to Jeff West (Eagles) and Robert Christenson (Vikings) for putting forth effort and keeping their team reports updated during the preseason.
 
Getting over this present hump will surely be a test of... many things,... not the least of which will be resilience.
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #142 on: Sep 9th, 2008, 8:38pm »
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the hardest part is thinking of something positive to say about the St Louis Lambs!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #143 on: Sep 21st, 2008, 2:34am »
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How's about MC and Ravenous T. keepin' up with The Rick here Week 3?  Way to keep it UP (shwing... ), guys, during these somewhat down times on "the Gridiron".
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #144 on: Oct 12th, 2008, 3:07pm »
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Hows about we continue to give it up for The Rick (Rams) and Ravenous T (Chargers) for continuing to hang in there and do their team reports during this "down" year on "the Gridiron"... and, for that matter, for their respective teams, at least thus far???  Thanks a bunch, you two!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #145 on: Oct 12th, 2008, 4:30pm »
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on Oct 12th, 2008, 3:07pm, StegRock wrote:
Hows about we continue to give it up for The Rick (Rams) and Ravenous T (Chargers) for continuing to hang in there and do their team reports during this "down" year on "the Gridiron"... and, for that matter, for their respective teams, at least thus far??? Thanks a bunch, you two!

 
 
  Good job guys....a weekend tournament of select baseball took me out of my football mode...I'll be back strong week 7!!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #146 on: Nov 18th, 2008, 8:09pm »
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How about giving it up for "The Rick", who, in spite of all the cutbacks here on "the Gridiron" this year as well as the poor season his team St. Louis is having, has kept it up with his Rams report now through Week 11? A fairly extraordinary effort all things considered, and this is on top of the fact that Rick has supported the site (and its owner) in every substantive way possible. He has made a number of substantial donations; he joined Steg's List the two years that was going on; he even ordered a number of t-shirts when I was doing that. That's the kind of devotion such a "grassroots", "cooperative" effort such as this requires. He is the kind of chap, who, hypothetically and potentially if I get this thing to where I want it to go, I'd welcome sharing an office and living the life rapping fantasy football with someday. Thank you, Rick, for all you've done to support the site and inspire me to press on in my efforts!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #147 on: Nov 23rd, 2008, 11:48am »
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I ain't no quitter.  Seriously, I enjoyed the site when it was a must see fantasy destination and can endure some setbacks.    Keep pluggin away Steg!
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #148 on: May 29th, 2009, 3:38am »
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Does ANYBODY think that bringing back the FF-specific Team Reports as a FEATURE of the site, with it understood that 1) there is nothing I can offer in return, save for a sharp-looking team-report page and, as I would surmise, 2) at best only a handful of teams being covered, is a good idea??? Or, is it best to not revisit this until it can be done right?
 
My thinking is that, vis-a-vis what else is out there, if we don't have all 32 teams covered reasonably well, it just doesn't look good (for the site) having it front and center as a feature. In fact, when a guest clicks on a lame one, especially if it's the first one they click into, I think it really hurts the site, and, remember, the work would be totally volunteer, so... With that said, we did have success way back in the beginning when it was just a handful of fairly well-done reports.
 
Thoughts???
« Last Edit: Jun 3rd, 2009, 6:45pm by Stegfucius » Logged
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Re: Interested in becoming a Junior Correspondent
« Reply #149 on: May 29th, 2009, 9:33am »
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Rather than just take them all down, why not set up an RSS feed on each one -- since you still have the Real Feed subscription, you could probably set up a filter to only show info on a certain team. Then you'd have current info on every page, and then you'd also have more detailed information to add to it from anyone who is still taking a team as a correspondent here.
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