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        Outside the Lines >> Forum Archives >>  The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
        
(Message started by: BarnabyWilde on May 18th, 2004, 2:15am)
Title: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by BarnabyWilde on May 18th, 2004, 2:15am
Okay guys...

Can we decide on whether we are going to pre determine our lottery pick order, or are we going to do it like the "original gangstas" in the GBRFL and do it on draft day, or do it before then?


Please post your thoughts/vote here on this thread...

Thanks,

BW
Title: Re: Can We Decide?
Post by StegRock on May 18th, 2004, 2:47am
Call a vote on it!  Start a "official" thread on which votes are to be cast; then, get all the dude's e-mail addresses and send out an e-mail with a link to that thread in it, and maybe even give everyone an extra heads-up by sending them an IM here on "the Gridiron" regarding it, as well.  Should take at most 15 minutes!  Good luck!
Title: Re: Can We Decide?
Post by BarnabyWilde on May 18th, 2004, 4:51am
Umm....that's kinda why I put this thread up...to have everyone vote here...guess that wasn't to clear, huh?  ;D



on 05/18/04 at 02:47:07, StegRock wrote:
Call a vote on it!  Start a "official" thread on which votes are to be cast; then, get all the dude's e-mail addresses and send out an e-mail with a link to that thread in it, and maybe even give everyone an extra heads-up by sending them an IM here on "the Gridiron" regarding it, as well.  Should take at most 15 minutes!  Good luck!
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Philly on May 18th, 2004, 9:30am
VOTE = DRAFT DAY

My vote is to wait until draft day.  I'd prefer not to mess with the GBRFL way of doing things... yet.  They do them for a reason over there and it seems to work, so when in Rome.
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by The Juror on May 18th, 2004, 2:14pm
I'd vote for knowing before hand. This only applies to the first 5 correct, 6-10 are set?
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by PrimeTime on May 18th, 2004, 2:15pm
I vote for knowing as soon as possible.  :)
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Chumpzilla on May 18th, 2004, 2:26pm
[smiley=Imwithstupid.gif]

WE ARE THE GBRFL2!  While I respect the tradition of the GBRFL, I feel we should begin some proud traditions as well!

I vote to know before the draft!
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by BarnabyWilde on May 18th, 2004, 3:42pm
Yes, this is true.


on 05/18/04 at 14:14:20, The Juror wrote:
I'd vote for knowing before hand. This only applies to the first 5 correct, 6-10 are set?
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by bgsgfan on May 19th, 2004, 10:50pm
My initial vote is to find out right before the draft.  It looks like the tide is going against me, however.  If we do decide on finding out earlier, how about making it a short time period, say one week before the draft?
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by BarnabyWilde on May 19th, 2004, 11:13pm
I vote to know early, 2 weeks is a good time. Gives everyone time to deal. My 2 cents...
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Tony_O on May 20th, 2004, 12:22am
I think if we were having a live draft then the day of the draft would make more sense, but since we are not drafting this way I believe we should find out before the draft.
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Walker Boh on May 21st, 2004, 6:31am
My vote is to wait until just before the draft. I explained myself in another thread, but to sum it up, I think this way will help create parity in the league as the "stronger" teams will have to pay more for the potential #1 pick.  
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by The Juror on May 21st, 2004, 9:26am
We have heard from 8 teams (5 to know before hand and 3 to know on draft day) I guess we need to see if the other 2 teams can weigh in on the issue.  Also, what do we do in the event of a deadlock?
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by PrimeTime on May 21st, 2004, 12:46pm
Not that I want to beat a dead horse, but if by some chance I get the number one pick, I am NOT going to make a draft selection until I have had the opportunity to trade that pick.  

The same will go for any spot I draft from 1 to 5.  If I know where I draft now I can spend time prior to the draft trying to trade the pick.  If not, it will just delay my pick as I try to trade it during the draft.  

I do not see anyone trading for the potential #1 pick by offering fair value for the #1 pick.  That just does not make sense and why would someone (ie me) trade away the potential #1 pick for less then fair value?
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Philly on May 21st, 2004, 2:51pm

on 05/21/04 at 12:46:00, PrimeTime wrote:
Not that I want to beat a dead horse, but if by some chance I get the number one pick, I am NOT going to make a draft selection until I have had the opportunity to trade that pick.  

The same will go for any spot I draft from 1 to 5.  If I know where I draft now I can spend time prior to the draft trying to trade the pick.  If not, it will just delay my pick as I try to trade it during the draft.  

I do not see anyone trading for the potential #1 pick by offering fair value for the #1 pick.  That just does not make sense and why would someone (ie me) trade away the potential #1 pick for less then fair value?


Shut up, you already voted.   ;)
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by PrimeTime on May 21st, 2004, 5:28pm
[smiley=Imwithstupid.gif]

[smiley=flamewar.gif] [smiley=eagle.gif] [smiley=wagingwar.gif]
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by FourTwoOh on May 21st, 2004, 6:42pm
The 2 leagues I've been in the longest, have both always decided draft order on draft day. I'm gonna go old school, and vote  to see that be the case here as well.
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by BarnabyWilde on May 21st, 2004, 6:58pm
Great. So Kirk's vote makes it 5-4 with only AWOL Jimmyc left to vote.

Since he has not been around for months, this may never get settled.  >:(
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by StegRock on May 21st, 2004, 9:27pm
Naaaaaa, Jim!  In the GBRFL, you can vote, "yes" or "no" or you can "abstain".  We usually set a deadline for our voting and someone missing the deadline just counts as an "abstain".  I would say for you guys at this point, since you did not set a deadline, someone send jimmyc, who may not even be back this year for all we know, an e-mail with a deadline within the next couple days, by the end of the weekend perhaps, OR, what might be most forthright, by the time you stated above you want to know the order, two weeks before the draft; that would, however, require you to now determine the start date of you all's draft.  Anyway, if he doesn't respond by whatever deadline you set, you go with the 5-4 verdict you've come to here. :)

Also, on a very related note, as per GBRFL tradition, if Jimmy has to be replaced, the new guy does not get a vote this year, i.e. on this issue.  You only get voting rights AFTER you have spent a year in the league.  Of course, I suppose you guys could vote on that as well, though. :-/

Also, in response to a question above, in the "mother league", tie goes to what's been done.  So, if it comes out 5 to 5, I suppose, if you want to follow tradition, you'd go with not knowing the order until the day of the draft (and vote again next year).  But, whatever! [smiley=shrug.gif]

Lastly, Primer, you do know the rationale you presented above is not really aboveboard.  It's not an "honest" basis for an "objective" decision.  It's "I'm pouting and taking my ball home" reasoning. [smiley=no.gif] :shameonyou:
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Philly on May 22nd, 2004, 11:25am

on 05/21/04 at 21:27:42, StegRock wrote:
 I would say for you guys at this point, since you did not set a deadline, someone send jimmyc, who may not even be back this year for all we know, an e-mail with a deadline within the next couple days, by the end of the weekend perhaps, OR, what might be most forthright, by the time you stated above you want to know the order, two weeks before the draft; that would, however, require you to now determine the start date of you all's draft.  Anyway, if he doesn't respond by whatever deadline you set, you go with the 5-4 verdict you've come to here. :)

Also, on a very related note, as per GBRFL tradition, if Jimmy has to be replaced, the new guy does not get a vote this year, i.e. on this issue.  You only get voting rights AFTER you have spent a year in the league.  Of course, I suppose you guys could vote on that as well, though. :-/


I sent Jimmy an email about 3 weeks ago asking him if he was still around and also sent a trade proposal.  He got back to me within a couple days and said he planned on sticking around (and turned down my trade  >:( ).  I sent him another email with yet another trade offer more than a week ago and have not heard back from him this time around...  [smiley=whatever.gif]
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Walker Boh on May 22nd, 2004, 1:27pm
I just got off the phone with JimmyC and he said he'd be on later today to make a post.
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Walker Boh on May 23rd, 2004, 5:29pm
I just got a call from JimmyC... He's having trouble with his online connection at home, so he asked me cast his vote. He would like to find out the day of the draft and that puts us at a deadlock, 5-5. JimmyC will confirm this post when he gets to work tomorrow.
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by PrimeTime on May 24th, 2004, 10:34am

on 05/21/04 at 21:27:42, StegRock wrote:
Primer, you do know the rationale you presented above is not really aboveboard.  It's not an "honest" basis for an "objective" decision.  It's "I'm pouting and taking my ball home" reasoning. [smiley=no.gif] :shameonyou:


??  ?.?.? ??  HUH?  I have no idea what you are talking about. I simply voted to know as soon as possible. (as did a few others)

The NFL has been highly successful with publishing their draft order well before the draft.  The NBA uses a "lottery" system like us and they also select their draft order well before their draft.  I wonder why they don't wait until draft day to decide?  
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by StegRock on May 24th, 2004, 12:36pm

on 05/21/04 at 12:46:00, PrimeTime wrote:
Not that I want to beat a dead horse, but if by some chance I get the number one pick, I am NOT going to make a draft selection until I have had the opportunity to trade that pick.  

The same will go for any spot I draft from 1 to 5.  If I know where I draft now I can spend time prior to the draft trying to trade the pick.  If not, it will just delay my pick as I try to trade it during the draft.

I do not see anyone trading for the potential #1 pick by offering fair value for the #1 pick.  That just does not make sense and why would someone (ie me) trade away the potential #1 pick for less then fair value?


Gene, maybe I didn't use the right analogy here.  In any event, I'm not talking about your initial post where you voted.  I'm talking about this post I've quoted (there's those natural rhymin' skills comin' out again [smiley=jammaster.gif] ... [smiley=awwgee.gif] ), especially the part in bold.  Maybe you aren't exactly "pouting and taking your ball home", but you are surely doing a fair amount of "arm-twisting", or we'll say "pleading" or "encouraging" (in a certain direction consistent with your vote).  Maybe, you forgot you made that post. [smiley=shrug.gif]

Additionally, factoring in what professional leagues do, which is your new approach as per your last post, is also rather erroneous.  Fantasy leagues, administratively speaking, share very little in common with real professional sports leagues.

That said I REALLY do not care what determination you guys come to.  Actually, the one I less prefer "philosophically" is probably the easier one "procedurally".  The point, however, is argue from within, not from without! [smiley=zenmaster.gif] If you don't feel you can do that to an adequate degree now, this year, "experience" the "traditional" way first AND THEN next year, when you can argue more from within the system and not from sources outside the system, you can vote again with more "information" on your side.  In that sense, I prefer you guys to go along with the "mother league's tradition", BUT ONLY IN THAT SENSE.  Once you have more information, sail off, my little grasshoppers! :)

But, if you really are hell-bent to sail off now, go for it. [smiley=shrug.gif] Know that it'll be hard to reverse field on this issue in the future, though.  Whereas, if you go with the "tradition", it would be rather easy to change next year or sometime in the future and you'd at least walk away from it having experienced something "new", whether you liked it or not. [smiley=shrug.gif]
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by PrimeTime on May 24th, 2004, 1:10pm

on 05/24/04 at 12:36:43, StegRock wrote:
you are surely doing a fair amount of "arm-twisting", or we'll say "pleading" or "encouraging" (in a certain direction consistent with your vote).  Maybe, you forgot you made that post. [smiley=shrug.gif]


Who made that post under my name?   ;)

Did I post that?

OK, Ok I admit it.

I am a compulsive pleading/encouraging, arm-twister.  It is a sickness I live with every day of my life.  I need to go to PEATA (Pleading Encouraging Arm-Twisters Anonymous), but everytime I go I keep trying to convince them to disband the organization. ;D

On a more serious note, I am really fine with whatever we decide to do.  I am in another league where we pick the draft order out of a hat right before we start the draft.  Personally, it does nothing for me either way because I prepare for every spot in the draft.  I will do the same here.  

If some people really get a kick out of finding out right before the draft where they will pick, then I would not want to cheat them out of that excitement.

Some of us are planners and some of us like to live in the moment.  Neither one is necessarily better (or Worse) than the other.  
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by BarnabyWilde on May 24th, 2004, 3:42pm
Well, I for one do not like the fact that I don't know what spot I am drafting in. But, do whatever you want. It was put to vote, so I won't complain about it.

And I totally disagree with Walker. There is absolutely no chance I trade my first round draft pick unless I know which spot I draft in. End of story there.
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Philly on May 24th, 2004, 3:48pm
Since the vote ended in a tie, why not keep discussing it for another week or two, and then re-vote?
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by StegRock on May 24th, 2004, 4:01pm

on 05/24/04 at 15:48:55, Philly wrote:
Since the vote ended in a tie, why not keep discussing it for another week or two, and then re-vote?


I believe that sets very bad precedent.  Keep voting on it (for this year) until when?  Also, I think that this "issue" has been HASHED out as much as it can be on two fronts:  a) it's really not that big of a deal, and b) as per what I said in my last post, you all will be in a "much better" position to make a "much more informed" decision on this next year... than this year. [smiley=shrug.gif]

But, whatever!  I'm just the voice of reason here.  You got a "tight vote", a 5-5 tie...  Have at it until your "hearts are content" (which I don't think will happen, though).
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by PrimeTime on May 25th, 2004, 11:57pm

on 05/22/04 at 13:27:36, Walker Boh wrote:
I just got off the phone with JimmyC and he said he'd be on later today to make a post.


Does anyone else get the feeling that there is no JimmyC?  Walker, are you SURE you talked to him? [smiley=shrug.gif]
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by Philly on May 26th, 2004, 9:22am

on 05/25/04 at 23:57:50, PrimeTime wrote:
Does anyone else get the feeling that there is no JimmyC?  Walker, are you SURE you talked to him? [smiley=shrug.gif]


I don't know his real-life situation, but I'd feel much more comfortable with an owner who seemed to take more of an interest in his team.  I've made two fair trade offers.  One was responded to fairly quickly.  In that email he indicated he was happy with his current team (the same one that landed him squarely in last place in 2003).  The second trade offer got no response at all.
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by jimmyc on May 26th, 2004, 7:08pm
okay boys im back and better than ever!! (cant go anywhere else but up when you are bringing up the rear)..there has been a rumor that jimmyc may be a figment of walker bohs imagination but im here to tell you that i actually exist and am gearing up for next season...i must say that i made quite the pitiful showing in my rookie season but rest assured i WILL field a competitive team and be active on a weekly basis from here on out!!! ive got a couple trade offers to date and let me just say that im NOT giving away any of my players for a song and dance!!!....FROM WORST TO FIRST!!!!!
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by bgsgfan on May 26th, 2004, 7:25pm
Good to see ya Jimmy!

I have a bunch of players you can have dirt cheap, that may be good enough to keep... but I can't.  Bettis, Dallas D, Antonio Bryant.  I would also be willing to move picks in exchange for a protection spot.  Maybe we can catch each other in chat right now?

Just to be sure, your vote is to find out draft position on the day of the draft, correct?
Title: Re: The "Official" Can We Decide? Thread
Post by jimmyc on Jun 2nd, 2004, 7:13pm
yes indeed and mabye we can work something out via a trade. time will tell!!!


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