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        the Gridiron >> the Red Zone >>  The Priest has gone Voodoo?
        
(Message started by: bgsgfan on Jun 30^th, 2003, 6:42pm)

Title: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by bgsgfan on Jun 30^th, 2003, 6:42pm

We started talking about this on another thread, but I believe it warrants a thread of its own. Our esteemed member #1 (Razzak) wrote an article on Priest Holmes at: http://www.ffgridiron.com/football/article.php?id=20030610161716. It is a very good read, and i recommend it highly, but I have to disagree with some of the key points he made.

1) From everything I have read, this is not a career threatening injury (ala Bo Jackson) and is not as serious as the injury to Edge. Everything that has come out (even though it has been limited) has stated he will be 100% for training camp. If this was all BS why would they set such a definite date and at such a high percentage? (i.e. they could have "eased him back into playing shape", or had "expectations of him being ready by the time the season starts", or "he is at 70%, but he is ready to begin working with the team")

2) I saw Priest tear up the Steelers prior to his move to KC. I will vehemently disagree with anyone who thinks this guy is a mediocre back. Yes, it is the right system for him. But, no, you could not just plug any back in that system and get the same results. I believe there are only a handful of backs in the modern NFL that could do what Holmes did (Faulk, Edge, and Tomlinson).

3) I do not believe Larry Johnson is any kind of threat to Holmes's playing time. LJ could never be the featured back in that type of system (although he could be a great back in a system that Pittsburgh used for years).

I am curious if there is anything I am missing? Philly dropped him completely off his board, why? Razzak, how do you respond to my comments? Does anyone else out there have any insight on this?

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by StegRock on Jun 30^th, 2003, 6:58pm

In the ongoing effort to keep things organized and substantive here and avoid redundancies, here is a related thread I would like to "connect" to this one:

http://www.fantasyfootballer.com/cgi-bin/theGridiron/YaBB.cgi?board=55;action=display;num=1047108444.

Feel free to continue discussion on this topic henceforth here, but know that many others have already expressed their views on the general topic of "Priest Holmes", of course not in light of Razzak Jallow's article, on this other thread! [smiley=bow.gif]

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by StegRock on Jun 30^th, 2003, 7:38pm

I have to concur with bgsgfan for the most part. It was written, "...he's a fantasy star and all, but as a NFL player he's overrated." I kind of feel the exact opposite almost. He's an under-appreciated and, for many years, under-used NFL player, who has had only two superb fantasy seasons and one other okay one, the year he ran for 1,000+ in Baltimore, and is now overrated as a fantasy player. He's like Tiki Barber, who we would have never known about, at least not to this degree, if Dayne really panned out. Both Tiki and Priest got skillz, period. Yes, Priest is in an auspicious situation given his specific skills in that offense, but HE is the difference between just good and REALLY GREAT. Richardson would have been "just good" as I think LJ would be, too.

Bottom line, though, are we here to evaluate him as an NFL player or a fantasy player? The latter, right? So, who cares about all the other stuff? I mean he is not a free-agent looking for a team (at this point). No two ways about it... you want that guy in that offense... if he's healthy, which leads me to the next point.

Regarding his health, people, in general, not necessarily Razz explicitly in his article, have made/are making a lot of erroneous analogies. It is NOT like Bo Jackson; that's pretty obvious at this point. We would know. Also, the comparisons being drawn between him and Terrell Davis are, well, tenuous. With Davis, there were always leaks that were very "up to interpretation". With Priest, things have been basically mum, but when word came out, it has been fairly definitive. Ultimately, I don't think anybody has a clue with regards to how he will specifically come out of this in the end, maybe not even Priest.

However, to imply that he is (easily) replacable and that KC would not go out of their way to get him on the field if he is healthy, is simply "not right" (in both senses). Yes, there is a significant "if" there. But, I think Razz's overall position is indicative of what Priest is suffering from the most, at the hands of all too many fantasy footballers: he is NOT a name-brand player, so to speak. I look forward to getting to know Razz better as a writer and will be curious to see his pieces in the future. Point being, I would love to know what he had to say about Edge, Faulk or J. Lewis going into last season. Well, going into next, we'll know where he stood on Priest.

Finally, specifically regarding the article, there are some notes I made about Razz's writing style, both positive and negative. [smiley=yinandyang.gif] Do you want that feedback, Razz? If so, how... by private message, e-mail, phone or right here? [smiley=shrug.gif]

Anyway, great job overall and thank you for adding YOUR energy to our great hobby! [smiley=bow.gif] Keep up the good work and keep your mind open so you can always continue growing! [smiley=zenmaster.gif]

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by bgsgfan on Jun 30^th, 2003, 8:17pm

Razz - I hope you don't think I am being over critical. Quite the opposite! I felt like the article merited my comments, and others. I remember someone taking a lot of heat regarding their opinion of and article on Ron Dayne. :P

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by StegRock on Jun 30^th, 2003, 8:37pm

I'm still hurting from those beatings! [smiley=gettinhammered.gif] And, you guys didn't get to see the E-MAILS! Fuckin' OUCH!

Razz, this is just the beginning and, trust me, you are playing in front of a "home crowd" here. As you should know, fortunately, we are a "reasonable" bunch; unfortunately, we know our fantasy football and are a "reason-able" bunch. Point being, we are not a bunch of "mouthy lemmings". In any case, you'll be okay, though, in the long run. Your enthusiasm is infectious. [smiley=thumbsup.gif] Just get ready for some bumps and bruises along the way. But, hold your ground!

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by Philly on Jun 30^th, 2003, 10:29pm

on 06/30/03 at 18:42:40, bgsgfan wrote:

Philly dropped him completely off his board, why?

I had Priest rated as my #1 RB in last year's draft. I owned him at the end of the 2001 season and felt he would break out in 2002. I got him last year and he carried me all season long - until I lost the Championship with him on my bench.

I am a HUGE Priest Holmes fan, and if any of you remember last season (FourTwoOh will)... the Chiefs are my AFC team of choice.

All that being said, if I knew Priest was going to be 100% healthy come September, or if I knew that he had no contract issues, then Priest would be #1 on my draft board again this year.

There are just too many question marks surrounding Priest this season - especially at this early juncture. By the middle of August (with a couple preseason games in the bank) he might very well be #1 in my eyes again. But right now spending a #1 pick on him is just way too risky in my eyes.

If everyone else felt the same way and he fell to me in Round 2, I would have definitely taken the chance, but a Round 1 selection can't have question marks.

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by BarnabyWilde on Jul 1^st, 2003, 5:58am

I had/have Priest ranked 5th, behind RW, LT2, Portis, Alexander and Faulk.

I am very scared that he is not talking about his injury. People in the organization say his injury is healed and he will be ready for camp, but he is saying nothing. I also know his contract is an issue in his eyes and would like to get that taken care of before camp starts...

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by Razzak on Jul 1^st, 2003, 11:43pm

on 06/30/03 at 22:29:37, Philly wrote:

I owned Priest at the end of the 2001 season and felt he would break out in 2002. I got him last year and he carried me all season long - until I lost the Championship with him on my bench.

If everyone else felt the same way and he fell to me in Round 2, I would have definitely taken the chance, but a Round 1 selection can't have question marks.

I had Priest last year and lost the championship with him and 7 other guys injured on my bench. I would have him as the #1 RB if not for the injury as well. I would also have selected him in the second half of round two if I had that pick and he fell.

I don't need to respond much to any of the points. I considered all of them before I wrote the article, and feel that the question marks surrounding Priest warrant taking others, such as Alexander, Portis, Faulk, and McAllister over him. Further, and while I don't mean to be rude, no one directly answered why the Chiefs would pick Johnson if they were perfectly happy with Priest and Richardson was returning. With the scarcity of trades in the NFL, "best player available" doesn't hold, especially with the Cheifs defensive needs.

This is Voodoo bust of the year folks. It has to be a consensus first rounder, and only Priest/Ricky/LT/Portis/Alexander/Faulk/McAllister fit that requirement. If I stepped up and predicted that Warrick Dunn wasn't going to pan out this year, who cares? The Voodoo article section is meant to tell you when to bench near-studs on a weekly basis. This is the once a year, yearly bust article.

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by Razzak on Jul 1^st, 2003, 11:51pm

on 06/30/03 at 18:42:40, bgsgfan wrote:

1) From everything I have read, this is not a career threatening injury (ala Bo Jackson) and is not as serious as the injury to Edge.

I know I said I wouldn't comment much, but...
It's more serious than Eddie George's Turf Toe.

I did just recieve a message suggesting that KC drafted Johnson for goal-line situations to preserve Priest's health. I fail to see how that would be good news.

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by StegRock on Jul 2^nd, 2003, 12:52am

on 07/01/03 at 23:43:54, Razzak wrote:

The Voodoo article section is meant to tell you when to bench near-studs on a weekly basis. This is the once a year, yearly bust article.

OH, my friend, RAZZ, woe is me! :( ??? You are not going to try to do what the "professionals" (read, not "experts") over at Fanball FAILED MISERABLY to do last year with their "Bench the Stud" pieces, are you? I mean predicting Priest Holmes to be this year's bust is one thing, and I can appreciate that viewpoint, but week in and week out advising people to break the "Golden Rule" of fantasy football,... [smiley=nono.gif] That's a slippery slope, my friend, and you have a fledgling [smiley=newbie.gif] web site on your hands. You don't want to lose credit too early in the going! [smiley=nervous.gif] [smiley=shrug.gif]

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by Razzak on Jul 2^nd, 2003, 1:25am

on 07/02/03 at 00:52:16, StegRock wrote:

You can wait and see. I almost never make a wrong move with my lineups for RB's, WR's, and TE's. If you're wondering, Tomlinson, Williams and Faulk probably won't make a single appearance.... but you never know.

It's really meant to be more of a fun selection than serious bench/start, because how am I supposed to tell you to bench Dillon when I don't know if your 3rd RB is Eddie George or Emmitt Smith?

Still, I would ask you not judge the suggestion as wrong before you've seen it in effect.

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by bgsgfan on Jul 4^th, 2003, 11:38am

From the "Mort Report", Chris Mortenson chat on ESPN: http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=3724

Quote:

Eric Iola,Ks: Mort, have you heard anything on the Preist Holmes injury front? I think he will be ok and ready to go but others arent so optimistic.

Chris Mortensen: I did see Priest Holmes last week and I can tell you is very confident about his recovery...almost like the cat that swallowed the canary. He looks great. He sounds ready to go. And the Chiefs doctors have told the team he should be ready. I guess we'll always have some doubt until we see him back on the field doing his thing.

More and more optimism... but its all from people you would expect to be optimistic.

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by StegRock on Jul 4^th, 2003, 12:42pm

Mort is the man, though, and he is an objective observer with nothing to lose or gain by "sugar-coating" the truth. I mean I know he is only relaying the story, but he has been known to editorialize when he feels the need to and he is usually right [smiley=bullseye.gif] with both his reports and editorials! The fact that he opts not to editorialize in the above quote to me says a lot. He does somewhat indicate his opinion, though, with "the cat that swallowed the canary" observation.

Title: Re: The Priest has gone Voodoo?
Post by Razzak on Jul 5^th, 2003, 12:41am

Great to hear. I hope Priest is back and healthy, because while I haven't personally met him I've heard he's a good guy.