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        the Gridiron >> the Red Zone >>  trade opinions please?
        
(Message started by: geojon on Oct 11^th, 2004, 7:31pm)

Title: trade opinions please?
Post by geojon on Oct 11^th, 2004, 7:31pm

Giving up Brooks, Gates, F. Tayor, D. Davis
Getting McNabb, Holt, W. Dunn, S. Jackson

Have
QB: Vick, Warner
RB: E. James, C. Taylor
WR: J. Walker, Chambers, R. Curry, A. Toomer,
TE: T. Gonzalez

Tks for any input you may have.

G

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by Krueger77 on Oct 11^th, 2004, 8:45pm

[Giving up Brooks, Gates, F. Tayor, D. Davis
Getting McNabb, Holt, W. Dunn, S. Jackson

Have
QB: Vick, Warner
RB: E. James, C. Taylor
WR: J. Walker, Chambers, R. Curry, A. Toomer,
TE: T. Gonzalez

--I'd say no. Gates is looking like the best TE in the league, definately better than Gonzalez (SO FAR this season, at least), and the RBs you'd be getting back are too inferior to what you're giving up. The only bright spot is getting Mcnabb. If you can reconfigure the deal a bit and not give up quite so much (maybe remove Taylor and Jackson from the deal), then you should probably do it.

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by Chumpzilla on Oct 11^th, 2004, 10:46pm

[smiley=no.gif] Sorry. I must disagree. Gonzo IS the man. he started slow last year and lit it up. Gates is no Gonzo. [smiley=jawdroppin.gif] Especially with Brees throwing to him. Don't get caught up in "what have you done lately." McNabb is a definite upgrade over Brooks (and Warner and Vick). Also, McNabb's bye week is done. I like Holt being your new #1. He WILL turn it up. I also like Dunn over Taylor. He will get running and receiving yardage. I'm also not a Dom Davis fan. Steven Jackson is getting increased action and is showing he can handle it. I like Jackson over Davis. Especially if this is a keeper league. Davis is also an injury risk.

For what it's worth! [smiley=dancin.gif]

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by KillerKingSting on Oct 11^th, 2004, 11:06pm

If this is a deep keeper league in which you get to retain most of these players then, I'd probably do the trade however, I still don't like Dunn - remove him from the trade and take back Taylor or Davis.

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by captainpurple on Oct 12^th, 2004, 10:08am

*phew*

tough call with so many variables. I'm goose-stepping with Chumpzilla on Gonzo vs Gates [smiley=ragin.gif] . You are upgrading both QB and WR significantly, while giving up only a slightly at TE. Gonzo is still going to get plenty of looks and redzone opps, you can afford to move Gates if you get enough back.

So it comes down to RB...Dunn is showing he's a good WCO back, and is really shining so far. Taylor has been close to a bust, with only 1 TD. Jackson's touches are increasing weekly, while Davis is fighting ankle injuries and hasn't taken off as of yet.

IMO, you really solidify your team with this trade. With Edge already in the RB fold, you can afford to give up the two name-brands for a potential starter in Jackson.

I'd go for it! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by lumber2121 on Oct 12^th, 2004, 11:50am

Gates is looking extremely good, but Gonzales is great. You may be able to get a little more if you include Gates. You may be able to cash in on his recent success. Because you have Gonzo, it is a lot easier to trade Gates. I too am iffy on Dunn. S. Jackson is one injury away from being a stud RB. He is a monster! Holt is good and McNabb is a definite upgrade. This is a tough one, but I would do it because you have James.

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by Philly on Oct 12^th, 2004, 2:10pm

on 10/11/04 at 19:31:17, geojon wrote:

Giving up Brooks, Gates, F. Tayor, D. Davis
Getting McNabb, Holt, W. Dunn, S. Jackson

Have
QB: Vick, Warner
RB: E. James, C. Taylor
WR: J. Walker, Chambers, R. Curry, A. Toomer,
TE: T. Gonzalez

You have to pull the trigger here. McNabb is a huge upgrade over Brooks (and think how much more he'll throw when Westbrook gets hurt). Holt is a stud (even with Bruce having a career year). Dunn is a nice complement to Edge (and seems to be just as injury prone as DomDavis is, so that's a wash). Jackson is solid already and will be huge when Faulk is hurt. And losing Gates won't hurt you since you already have Gonzo and his bye-week is behind him.

Do it!

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by BarnabyWilde on Oct 15^th, 2004, 12:34pm

I agree with the Philster, I'd do this trade as well.

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by junkyardjake on Oct 15^th, 2004, 12:54pm

I kindof agree with Philly that the trade should help you, but he also mentioned a key contingency that would need to happen first; Stephen Jackson needs to take over the starting job from Marshall Faulk.

In the absence of this, I think you are basically revamping your opponent's team for him/her, and not really helping yourself all that much.

Sure Mcnabb is an upgrade over Brooks or Vick, but QBs are easy to pickup on the waiver wire. For example, Drew Brees or Ben Roethlisberger will probably have a few games where they outplay McNabb. Remember, outside or Terrell Owens, the Eagles still don't have a reliable wide receiver.

As far as receivers, you get Holt, but you already have J. Walker, Chambers and Toomer, so your improvement is marginal here too.

But the key problem with this trade I think is the fact that you give up 2 starting RBs and get Dunn, not bad, but not a sure thing because of his size, and Stephen Jackson, who is not a starter.

I would counter-offer with something like this:

(Brooks -OR- Vick)
Gates,
(F. Tayor -OR- D. Davis)
And maybe even throw in Chambers or Toomer

For

McNabb, Holt, W. Dunn and S. Jackson

JYJ :^)

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by sameoldsameold on Oct 15^th, 2004, 2:31pm

i agree with philly also....make the trade!

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by Philly on Oct 15^th, 2004, 5:07pm

on 10/15/04 at 12:54:52, junkyardjake wrote:

Jackson outscored Faulk last week and he's not even starting yet, but is getting used more and more each week.

Quote:

Sure Mcnabb is an upgrade over Brooks or Vick, but QBs are easy to pickup on the waiver wire. For example, Drew Brees or Ben Roethlisberger will probably have a few games where they outplay McNabb. Remember, outside or Terrell Owens, the Eagles still don't have a reliable wide receiver.

I don't think Brees or Roethlisberger have outscored McNabb once this season. I'm sure it could happen, but the Eagles have a very efficient passing offense that is built on TO, the TEs, and also RBs. I agree that Pinkston and Mitchell aren't as involved, but no one has been able to stop the passing game so far, so why not grab McNabb?

Quote:

As far as receivers, you get Holt, but you already have J. Walker, Chambers and Toomer, so your improvement is marginal here too.

Holt is a marked improvement over Chambers and Toomer.

Quote:

But the key problem with this trade I think is the fact that you give up 2 starting RBs and get Dunn, not bad, but not a sure thing because of his size, and Stephen Jackson, who is not a starter.

I would counter-offer with something like this:

(Brooks -OR- Vick)
Gates,
(F. Tayor -OR- D. Davis)
And maybe even throw in Chambers or Toomer

For

McNabb, Holt, W. Dunn and S. Jackson

JYJ :^)

This proposal is certainly a better one, but I doubt the other owner would go for it.

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by junkyardjake on Oct 15^th, 2004, 5:56pm

Quote:

Jackson outscored Faulk last week and he's not even starting yet, but is getting used more and more each week.

I agree if the trend of using Jackson over Faulk turns into more than that, this trade makes sense. But looking at the last two weeks, it's hard to say that Jackson will currently replace the loss of Taylor or D. Davis in that trade:

Last week:

Faulk- 15 carries 51 yards
Jackson- 5 carries 64 yards

The previous week:

Faulk - 23 carries 121 yards
Jackson - 10 carries 46 yards 1 TD

I guess it's kind of a 2/3rds Faulk, 1/3rd Jackson situation, but I agree Jackson is outplaying Faulk.

Quote:

I don't think Brees or Roethlisberger have outscored McNabb once this season.

Believe it or not, Drew Brees had a better game than McNabb in Week 4:

Brees 206 yards, 3 TDs
McNabb 237 yards, 1 TD

But you know that's not even my point, I was just throwing out names of QBs you wouldn't think of starting to emphasize the point that QB's are less valuable than starting runningbacks for fantasy purposes.

I think McNabb is without question one of the top three QBs in the league, Brees will never be in his class and Roethlisberger might be someday, but that's probably 2-3 years from now.

Quote:

Holt is a marked improvement over Chambers and Toomer.

No doubt, I just don't think enough improvement to compensate for the loss of a starting runningback.

JYJ :^)

Title: Re: trade opinions please?
Post by lumber2121 on Oct 17^th, 2004, 11:06am

Do you have keepers in your league? If so, Jackson is a stud in waiting. It could happen this year is Faulk gets injured. It could happen next year if Faulk retires. Apparently, Faulk has said that he would like to go out on top, a la Robert Smith. Either way, it is only a matter of time before Jackson explodes on the scene.

Even though you are giving up two starting running backs for one, I would still do the deal. You will still be in good shape at running back.