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        the Gridiron >> the Red Zone >>  C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
        
(Message started by: lumber2121 on Jul 16^th, 2005, 12:44am)

Title: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by lumber2121 on Jul 16^th, 2005, 12:44am

Okay, it is getting close to draft day. I have asked this question here before and I will now ask it again. The information is more clear at this point, but not entirely lucid. Who should I keep in a league with only one keeper, Chad Johnson or Steven Jackson?

I am leaning towards Jackson. While he may not be as strong as Johnson in the coming year, Jackson will probably be a bigger stud in the years to come. Jackson may have some of his time compromised by M. Faulk and who knows how much Martz will want to run. This said, the Rams are playing a lot of weak run defenses this year. So, he could put up some big numbers even if his carries are somewhat limited by Faulk.

Chad Johnson is on the verge of becoming one of the dominant wide receivers in the game. He and Palmer did very well together in the second half and Johnson, with the exception of touchdowns, has put up very comparable numbers to M. Harrison over the last two seasons.

I think I may be able to get Johnson in the first round. Then again, I may be able to get Julius Jones, Rudi Johnson or Domminick Davis (sp?) in the first round. If I can leave the first round with Johnson and Jackson, I would be very happy. There should be enough running backs in the second round for me to get a decent number two.

My quandry is clear. Do I protect a guy who I think will be one of the top wide receivers this year or do I keep a guy who has great long-term value?

I won my league championship last year largely on the shoulders of the Bills DST and Antonio Gates. Therefore, I understand that a season is not solely reliant on the first two or three rounds. Regardless, I have a tough decision and would love some help.

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by StegRock on Jul 16^th, 2005, 11:43am

(Somewhat in accordance with my "the better half" rankings here in "the Red Zone) You gotta go with the RB Jackson. To me, all else has to be put aside, you gotta go with the #12 RB over the #4 WR. The one disclaimer,... if you were like 90% sure you could get Rudi, who I have ranked #6 among RB's, in your draft. Then, maybe, just maybe, I would keep Chad. On the other hand, if you did that, you'd be putting a lot of your eggs in the Bengal [smiley=pussycat.gif] basket, a VERY dangerous tight-rope to be walking despite ALL the hype. Good luck! [smiley=shamrock.gif]

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by GOLF_FREAK on Jul 18^th, 2005, 6:47am

If you need two rb's and possibly a third as a flex, go with davis. Starting off with two stud rb is a much better situation than 1 and a decent wr. Plus if you think he will be that good in the future then why let him go for someone else to get

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by Philly on Jul 18^th, 2005, 9:11am

I'm still of the mind that you need to go with Steven Jackson over Chad Johnson. Jackson will not lose much to Marshall Faulk this year and even less in the future. With so many teams having a RBBC, you've got to tie up a stud RB when you can.

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by DirkDiggler on Jul 18^th, 2005, 9:23am

on 07/18/05 at 09:11:05, Philly wrote:

Ditto what he said. Gotta go with Jackson!

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by lumber2121 on Jul 18^th, 2005, 10:39am

Thanks, fellas. Your advise is very sound. I will probably protect Jackson. This seems like the most sound move.

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by prm on Jul 20^th, 2005, 8:46pm

i agree - always a starting rb over a wr - i believe wrs are flavor of the week no matter who they are (after the top 2) - but rbs are the guys who carry you and i can think of worse starters than jackson...
prm..

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by mutantseabass on Jul 21^st, 2005, 2:55pm

How many keepers do you get? Who are your others?(if there are others). Also what is your scoring system. If you use points per reception CJ would be huge. Chad Johnson was the most targeted wide reciever last year. I like Stephen Jackson just dont like Jackson in Martz system. What pick do you have in the draft? These things would help me make a more educated response to your post.

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by StegRock on Jul 21^st, 2005, 3:24pm

He gets 1 keeper, msb. He states that. He doesn't tell us what exact pick he has, but he does mention who he's likely looking at getting with the pick he has in the first round. I appreciate your thoroughness, msb, of course. So, don't get me wrong... But, the way you put it, you kind of make it sound like the prior responses were "uneducated" as opposed to what you'll come up with with further information,... when in fact adequate enough info may have been given to make an appropriately educated response. I mean unless there's a bomb he forgot to drop on us, I think the analysis heretofore is fairly accurate. But, anyway, have at it... :) The scoring system surely would be a valuable extra piece of info... though, barring its being a fluky system, it very likely won't change things all too much.

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by StegRock on Jul 21^st, 2005, 4:34pm

on 07/21/05 at 14:55:56, mutantseabass wrote:

I like Stephen Jackson just dont like Jackson in Martz system.

So, what is it, msb, that you don't like about Jackson in Martz's system? I mean, mind you, I am not a fan of Mike Martz, but I think I still like Jackson in that system. I do think, based on his size and build, that he is better suited to a Denver Broncos-type system, but I still think he'll do great in St. Louis.

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by mutantseabass on Jul 21^st, 2005, 4:58pm

First off i would like to apologize, i didnt mean for the way i worded that to come out as meaning the other responses were uneducated. They were very good responses, i was meaning for me to give accurate advise i do like to know the scoring system. Again i do apologize for anyone who took that the wrong way.

As for Jackson, i just do not like the way Martz runs the offence. Ever since Faulk started his decline the Rams have been a very pass happy offence. Meaning Jacksons #s could be much better. In my opinon the reason Faulk did so well in that offence was his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield and his ability to block as well as he does. Pass blocking is not Jacksons forte, maybe he will pick it up this year.

Again i feel real bad about the misunderstanding :-X

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by StegRock on Jul 21^st, 2005, 8:13pm

[offtopic]Thanks, msb, for the contrite "comeback" (double-entendre intended). [smiley=bow.gif] Way to gain (my) respect! [smiley=yes.gif] But, really, you need not feel all too bad. I was just expressing with forthrightness the (logical) implication of your post (that, I thought, you likely did not intend). In any case, as the guys around here will tell ya, I tend to be a bit spotty... every day of the month. ;) ... ;D[/offtopic]

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by bgsgfan on Jul 22^nd, 2005, 1:21am

I think knowing the rules regarding this league could have significance here.

Generally, I agree with Jackson, however if (a little unlikely) the starting players required are skewed towards receivers (i.e. 3 WRs and 2 RBs) I might go with Johnson. I also might be a little more inclined to Johnson if there are points awarded for receptions - more due to Faulk's continued presence than anything else.

Would anyone else be interested in trading for one of these players - perhaps a trade would benefit both teams?

Title: Re: C. Johnson or S. Jackson who to keep
Post by lumber2121 on Jul 25^th, 2005, 12:19pm

First of all, thank you all for your input. I hope that I can be as helpful you all at some point.

Here is some additional information that hopefully will answer everyone's quesitons.

I have the fourth pick in a snake (I have the 4th, 21st, 27th, 44th, etc.) At the time of my original posting I did not know the draft order. This information should help a lot.

We do not get points for receptions
TDs are 6 points
Yardage scoring is fairly standard

We can only protect one player

We start 1 QB, 2 WR, 2 RB, 1 TE, 1 DST, 1 K each week

The only way I think I could trade Johnson or Jackson is if I traded a pick or traded for a pick. I do not think that our league allows us to trade draft picks. If I could trade a draft pick, I might, I stress might, be able to unload Johnson or Jackson to the guy who would have to protect Hesslebeck or Taylor (see below). This guy has the 2nd pick in the draft.

Here is a list of players who have the potential to be protected. Each line represents one team. A slash between players means that they will protect one or other.

S. Alexander/D. McNabb
R. Moss/P. Holmes
H. Ward (owner is a huge Steelers fan)
L. Tomlinson
D. Culpepper/J. Lewis
P. Manning/W. McGahee (big Bills and Huricanes fan sp he may protect McGahee)
D. McAllister/T. Owens
F. Taylor/M. Hasselbeck (seriously, these are by far his two best players)
E. James
C. Portis/D. Davis
T. Barber/A. Green
and obviously
S. Jackson/C. Johnson

Please let me know if any other information would be helpful.