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        the Gridiron >> between the 20's >>  Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
        
(Message started by: Tony_O on Apr 6^th, 2004, 10:58am)

Title: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by Tony_O on Apr 6^th, 2004, 10:58am

Monday, April 5, 2004

By Len Pasquarelli
ESPN.com

COLUMBUS, Ohio -- On a day when it might have been easier to tunnel into Fort Knox than to have gained access to the school's football complex, Ohio State tailback Maurice Clarett likely earned himself a bit more gold in the 2004 NFL draft, turning in a credible performance in his first full-scale audition for scouts.

The workout, in front of dozens of curious talent evaluators, was more solid than it was scintillating. It did, however, go a long way toward answering lingering questions about Clarett's maturity, physical conditioning and overall quickness in football-related drills.

"He is a good football player and he demonstrated that," said Cincinnati Bengals head coach Marvin Lewis.

Clarett
Clarett, who looked to be in better shape than some skeptics had predicted, was clocked in the mid- to high-4.5s, according to the consensus of four scouts in attendance, all of whom spoke to ESPN.com. One of the four scouts said he timed the former Buckeyes star at 4.56. The other three had him in the 4.58-4.59 range. A fifth scout, not in the consensus group, got a high time of 4.62 in one of the three 40-yard sprints that Clarett performed.

The tailback, scouts noted, also ran in the 1.7s for 10 yards.

Given the lack of access -- even Clarett's representatives, who were not permitted into the workout, sat at a local grille with some friends while their client auditioned -- information was sketchy at first. But as scouts headed to the airport or to their hotels, the overall take on Clarett's performance became clearer. The general feeling was that Clarett was more focused than some scouts anticipated and that he understood the significance of satisfying some of the doubts surrounding him.

Clarett said he was "pretty happy" with the results.

"I felt like I was prepared and, while you're probably never completely satisfied, it was a good workout and a good experience," Clarett said.

In many draft classes, his times might be considered pedestrian, but the 2004 pool at the tailback position is hardly rife with sprinters. So, while not eye-opening, the times were certainly as good as, if not better in a few instances, than those of prospects considered as the top four tailbacks in the 2004 draft.

Those four tailbacks -- Steven Jackson (Oregon State), Kevin Jones (Virginia Tech), Chris Perry (Michigan) and Greg Jones (Florida State) -- all ran between 4.53-4.62. Kevin Jones' time was disappointing enough in his first "pro day" workout, that he convened a second audition.

“ I felt like I was prepared and, while you're probably never completely satisfied, it was a good workout and a good experience. ”
—RB Maurice Clarett

"He answered some questions, for sure, and he's probably a first-day guy now," one scout from an AFC team said. "He moved better than I thought he would and he had a better change of direction than I had seen on tape. Plus he caught the ball well. I could see him maybe going in the second (round) now. Probably no worse than the third (round)."

In addition to the 40 results, Clarett performed 19 "repetitions" of the standard 225-pound bench press. He had a 36½-inch vertical jump and he registered a long jump of 9 feet, 6 inches. His time in the "short shuttle," a drill designed to display change of direction skill, was in the 4.3-second range, relatively average, and one scout noted that Clarett looked a bit "tight" in the hips.

Perhaps most notable about the Clarett workout: His conditioning and the manner in which he caught the ball.

Clarett measured 5-foot-11 3/8, actually one-eighth of an inch shorter than at the combine. But his weight, 230 pounds, was seven pounds less than it was in Indianapolis, and 12 pounds less than Clarett conceded he weighed five days before his combine appearance. There had been concerns that Clarett, who opted in recent weeks to train closer to home, might be overweight, but 230 pounds is what Ohio State listed as his playing weight in 2002.

Although not noted for his hands, Clarett had just one drop in the receiving drills.

Scouts have been anticipating the Clarett workout, some of them fairly eagerly, since he declined to participate in the drills at the Indianapolis combine two months ago.

One team that does not want to be identified had a private audition with Clarett last week, ESPN.com learned, and was impressed by his performance. Clarett did not run a 40-yard sprint in that private workout, but was said to be generally more athletic than expected.

Len Pasquarelli is a senior NFL writer for ESPN.com.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by Tony_O on Apr 6^th, 2004, 11:01am

Clarett runs 4.6-plus 40-yard dash during workout
April 5, 2004
SportsLine.com wire reports

COLUMBUS, Ohio -- Maurice Clarett ran, jumped, lifted weights and caught footballs for pro scouts on Monday. By and large, they came away impressed.

Advertisement

"Obviously he's going to be a bellcow for somebody -- he's got that type of ability," said former NFL fullback Tom Rathman, who represented the Detroit Lions. "It's just a matter of him developing as a football player."

Clarett had declined to work out at the NFL combine in February, so this was the first time scouts had seen the 20-year-old who could force his way into the draft later this month depending on the decision of an appeals court.

Clarett weighed 230 pounds, exactly his playing weight when he last took the field for the Buckeyes 15 months ago. He had times of 4.66, 4.63 and 4.67 seconds in his three 40-yard dashes, a standing long jump of 9 feet, 5 inches and a vertical jump of 36.5 inches. He lifted 225 pounds 19 times.

Almost every NFL team sent a scout. Clarett was joined in some of the drills by cornerback/wide receiver Chris Gamble and wide receiver Drew Carter, teammates on Ohio State's 2002 national championship team.

Clarett rushed for 1,237 yards and scored 16 touchdowns -- both freshman records at Ohio State -- while leading the Buckeyes to a 14-0 record in 2002.

The NCAA suspended Clarett prior to last season for accepting improper benefits from a family friend and then lying about it to investigators.

He sat out what would have been his sophomore season, then challenged the NFL rule requiring a player to be out of high school for three years before becoming draft eligible. He won the first step in early February when a federal judge ruled that the NFL could not prevent him from being in the draft.

That decision is being appealed by the NFL and attorneys were filing briefs while Clarett prepared for Monday's workout. The appeal is expected to be heard in New York the week before the April 24-25 draft.

Most of the scouts who talked to reporters after the workout were generally complimentary.

Former NFL wide receiver Paul Warfield, representing the Miami Dolphins, said he wasn't concerned about what many would consider the slow times for Clarett in the 40.

"He's a proven player -- at least for one year -- in terms of his running ability," Warfield said. "He finds holes, he reads blocks exceptionally well and he played in one of the best conferences in college football. You look at production.

"He certainly gave people an indicator of some of the things that he can do."

Clarett did not speak with reporters.

AP NEWS
The Associated Press News Service

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Apr 6^th, 2004, 12:17pm

And just to throw another spin out there...

From http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

Quote:

POSTED 2:25 a.m. EDT, April 6, 2004
by Len Lasagna and Mike Florio

LET THE TRUTH BE TOLD: CLARETT BLOWS IT

Notwithstanding all the media cheering and cooing about how Maurice Clarett did better than expected Monday at the Ohio State Pro Day, several NFL scouts and insiders have told us the real deal -- The Litigious One won't have anyone forgetting about Jim Brown (running at his current age) anytime soon. One scout told us that Clarett "may not even surpass the mediocre pro career" of another OSU running back -- Archie Griffin. For more on this story and other quotes from NFL insiders on the Clarett workout, go to our sister site -- Collegefootballtalk.com.

Demonstrating once again the imperfections of getting solid 40 times from a gaggle of road-weary scouts with stop-watch fingers of varying dexterity, some reports have Clarett's fastest time at 4.55, while other reports show each of his three efforts in the 40 over 4.6

And like Virginia Tech running back Kevin Jones, the fact that Clarett ran the 40 three times (instead of the usual two times) is evidence that Clarett was disappointed with his initial efforts.

Also, we don't put much stock in the fact that guys like Detroit's Tom Rathman were raving about Clarett after the fact. This time of year, everyone's lying about who they like and who they don't.

If, after all, hype from a team like the Lions might prompt someone to pull the trigger on Clarett before the Lions pick in a given round, it merely raises the likelihood that the guy the Lions are coveting at that time will still be on the board when they are on the clock.

-------------

And the aforementioned piece from http://www.collegefootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

Quote:

POSTED 12:01 a.m. EST, Tuesday, April 6, 2004

CLARETT WORKOUT FAILS TO IMPRESS

Notwithstanding all the over hype promulgated by that Fat Guy who writes for ESPSnooze (we think we saw a sixth chin in his mug shot this week), several pro scouts who saw Maurice Clarett's workout yesterday at the Ohio State pro day didn't come out with pup tents. Per one pro guy: "the kid had all spring to prepare for this and he does OK -- not great -- but OK -- wouldn't you think with all the hype he would be in the best shape of his life?" Another NFL insider told us that Clarett "blew his chance to make himself a lot of coin -- now not only does he have to face the heat from the teams but he'll also get crap from his Mommy." Several NFL people stated that the less than stellar preparation by The Litigation One further reaffirmed their belief that Clarett is not mature enough to face the constant mental grind of the NFL ("he's a project at best").

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 6^th, 2004, 1:52pm

on 04/06/04 at 12:17:31, Philly wrote:

And just to throw another spin out there...

The key word there being "spin". I mean don't not post their stuff, Jeff, whoever, but I am surely allowed to respond and I am keeping tabs on, especially, "ProFootballTalk.com" (now it's... in a claim made in mid-March, Brad Johnson's done in Tampa in "June", oh, yea, likely done ::) or was it "don't be surprised if he's done?" ::) , hedged speculation (isn't that a double negative?); Clarett's career is going to be a bust (again a "claim" that when it can be substantiated, will be looooong forgotten about,... not here, though). Keep feedin' me (because I don't really want to waste my time going over there)!

Then, get a load of their stupid and juvenile jeering of ESPN and Pasquarelli, whom, though I am not a tremendous fan of, I know these clowns couldn't carry water for. It is VERY unprofessional and actually the ESPsnooze joke is just plain dumb. That pretty much tells the story of these [smiley=clown.gif]'s right there.

Of course, all of their sources are nameless "NFL Insiders", "NFL people" and "pro 'guys'" and "one" again unnamed "scout". [smiley=pullleeeeeeeze.gif] How about substantively addressing ALL the DIRECT and ACTUAL claims and quotes Pasquarelli got and cited? Do these clowns consider the angle that maybe some representatives, more of the "poker playing" mentality, want to play things down right now with the draft right around the corner? Of course, that "spin" wouldn't lead to the "bold" claim they "want" to make. On the other hand, they even admit, "This time of year, everyone's lying about who they like and who they don't." So, what kind of fuckin' double-talk is that??? Pasquarelli's named sources are lying and your anonymous sources are telling the truth!?!? [smiley=pullleeeeeeeze.gif] Please, spare me!

...

I betchya Clarett ends up in Denver and BLOWS up in '05; either that, or not. ;)

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Apr 6^th, 2004, 3:06pm

Regardless of your opinions of profootballtalk.com, I know that people in the biz (players, agents, administrative types) are reading the site... are they contributing on an anonymous basis? I see no reason to believe that they aren't.

One of the most important things in fantasy football is information. If I can get some information at this site that might not be available elsewhere, then good for me. Is it misinformation? Honestly, I don't know. They've gotten some things right and they've blown some things (which they've been very quick to admit). Will Brad Johnson find himself on the outs in Tampa? We'll find out.

Regarding the Clarett issue... following his freshman season, a lot of football people thought the world of this guy. Now he's maybe a first day pick? What happened? Sure there was the legal issue and all, but none of that had any direct bearing on his physical ability and skills... yet he's gone from a potential top ten pick to a potential 3rd rounder. Warren Sapp and Randy Moss each had "character" issues that dropped them from top ten to mid-first round. Why has Clarett fallen so far? He takes the NFL to court in order to get himself a job interview. Once he wins the right to enter the NFL, he shows a complete lack of discipline (again, in a different manner) by showing up at the combine looking more like Len Pasquarelli than an elite RB. He sets a date to showcase his talents and he gives an average performance. (No, his speed wasn't the result of a slow track as Drew Carter -- still recovering from injury -- put up 4.4s on the same track on the same day.)

Maybe his performance was being hyped a bit by Pasquarelli. Is he completely unbiased because he works for a (supposedly more) reputable venue in ESPN? If we are to believe that, then I should trust Dan Rather and Tom Brokaw to be unbiased as well...

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 6^th, 2004, 3:25pm

Uhhhh,... okay.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 6^th, 2004, 4:57pm

I'll grant you this, Philly. CBS Sportsline "links to", but does not title, their article about Clarett's workout thusly: Clarett good, not great in workout. The article still takes the same tone as Pasquarelli's, that of the initial AP reports', which is basically positive.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Apr 6^th, 2004, 5:22pm

on 04/06/04 at 13:52:31, StegRock wrote:

Of course, all of their sources are nameless "NFL Insiders", "NFL people" and "pro 'guys'" and "one" again unnamed "scout". [smiley=pullleeeeeeeze.gif]

One of the writers who I regularly read because I trust his insight and enjoy his writing is Pat Kirwan over at NFL.com. However, he seems to use a lot of those "nameless insiders" too. I guess he's full of crap [smiley=caughtonthecan.gif] and just blowing smoke too... [smiley=texan.gif]

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 6^th, 2004, 9:03pm

on 04/06/04 at 17:22:24, Philly wrote:

Your argument is cyclical. ... Am I to then reason, logically,... a) you read Pro Football Talk's rumor mill; b) Pro Footall Talk's rumor mill is garbage; c) therefore, you read garbage; d) you also read Pat Kirwan; e) therefore, Pat Kirwan's writing is garbage? Of course not! But, that's the gaping hole (in logic) you leave open. ... You are comparing apples and oranges, anyway, which can't be done logically. Try to diagram your argument and you'll see what I mean. You really can't; it's not much of an "argument". The "nameless insiders" are just evidence, not a crucial premise of the logical argument: "if you use nameless insiders, you are full of crap"; contrapositively, "if you are not full of crap, you do not use nameless insiders" is surely not the premise (one wants to predicate their argument on). That would be ridiculous. ... In any event, I, personally, am not that crazy about Kirwan. Factor that into things and it could get really ugly, from a logical standpoint (thought the premises would surely be erroneous).

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Apr 6^th, 2004, 9:33pm

on 04/06/04 at 21:03:18, StegRock wrote:

Many, many years ago, as a college freshman, I took a class, Philosophy 101: Logic, Reasoning, and Persuasion, so I too know the old if all As are Bs, and all Bs are Cs, then all As must be Cs routine. I was employing it as a bit of hyperbole, which I'm sure you were clever enough to recognize.

Of course I just trotted that out there as an example. You were arguing that the authors at the rumor mill lacked some credibility because they did not name their sources, leaving them, instead, as anonymous entities. And I recognize that anonymous sources leaves one open to question. That's part of the deal. Now regarding Pat Kirwan (your feelings toward him and/or his writing aside), he too uses anonymous sources rather frequently. Pat Kirwan, however, was an NFL executive with the Jets and now works for the NFL, so it is safer to assume that his anonymous sources are more reliable. Therefore, you would probably be less likely to question them (I'm jumping to a conclusion here; one, which, if inaccurate, I'm sure you'll be happy to point out). Regardless, an unnamed source is just that. It is up to the reader to determine if that unnamed source is credible or not.

I have no reason to believe that profootballtalk.com has any motivation to just make up stories for sheer shock value, hoping that once in a while even the blind squirrel finds a nut. I don't know any of the faces behind profootballtalk.com, so it's a blind leap of faith on my part to take their information seriously. However, as I do know some of the goings-on in the matters concerning player agents, I know that their information is accurate in many regards concerning agents. Because of this, I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on some of their other stories.

....

Now, back to Pat Kirwan... what is it that you don't like about him? I find that he puts out a lot of thought-provoking, substantive information. He has a clean, easy writing style. He is willing to share his opinions on controversial issues, yet deftly walks the fine line between being heavy-handed and merely assertive.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 7^th, 2004, 12:24am

on 04/06/04 at 21:33:55, Philly wrote:

I have no reason to believe that profootballtalk.com has any motivation to just make up stories for sheer shock value, hoping that once in a while even the blind squirrel finds a nut.

I know that you are not saying that this is my contention, but... I just don't want that to become the implication. As per our last debate on this topic, I do NOT think they do this for "sheer shock value". I think they're much more clever than that. I think it is more of a disingenuous, subtle attention-getting technique.

Quote:

Now, back to Pat Kirwan... what is it that you don't like about him? I find that he puts out a lot of thought-provoking, substantive information. He has a clean, easy writing style. He is willing to share his opinions on controversial issues, yet deftly walks the fine line between being heavy-handed and merely assertive.

Regarding Pat Kirwan, he's okay. He's a fine NFL commentator. He's just not a fantasy guy at all really. That's why he's not high on my list. I find that he speaks much more to the general NFL fan than the fantasy footballer, especially vis-a-vis a Peter King, Chris Mortensen, John Clayton, etc. I don't find his commentary to be as useful (as theirs) fantasy-wise, specifically. So, that's it for me. I'm just out to cut to the chase and I prefer guys with more of a fantasy slant to their writing.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Apr 7^th, 2004, 9:31am

on 04/07/04 at 00:24:40, StegRock wrote:

[smiley=thumbsup.gif] Gotcha... I guess I'm more of an NFL guy than a fantasy guy overall. I mean, I've been following the NFL for mroe than 30 years while I've only been playing fantasy football for about 7 or 8 years.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 7^th, 2004, 11:32am

I too have been an NFL fan since I was a knee-high grasshopper. But, I have played fantasy football for damn near half my life now; this is year 16 for the Stegger. Next year, it will have officially caught up to me halfway. :o It has definitely become that which defines me as an NFL fan, surely at this point, and has made me as avid of an NFL fan as I have become. [smiley=bow.gif]

...

And, Tony, sorry for hijacking your thread like this. :-[

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Works Out for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Apr 7^th, 2004, 11:55am

Well, let's get this thread back to its intended topic...

More news (rumors) from http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

Quote:

POSTED 7:45 a.m. EDT, April 7, 2004

MORE DETAILS FROM CLARETT WORKOUT

A league source has shared with us some additional details regarding the Monday workout of Maurice Clarett in Columbus.

The average time obtained by the source for Clarett's 40-yard dash was 4.66, with a top speed of 4.64. Per the source, the fast surface on which Clarett ran resulted in an adjustment to 4.70 to 4.72 -- not exactly speedy for a running back.

Clarett also was "average" in his agility drills, according to the source, and he still appeared to be out of shape. He "was sucking wind by the end of the workout," said the source.

The source tells us that, in his view, Clarett is still too much of a risk to warrant a selection on the first day of the draft, but the source acknowledges that someone may pull the trigger.

[smiley=cantcatch.gif]

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 7^th, 2004, 12:42pm

Keep diggin' that grave! The deeper it is, the better the shove will feel! [smiley=yes.gif]

You can't keep quoting the same source and give me the... [smiley=cantcatch.gif] Of course, they're going to back "their" story. [smiley=shrug.gif] Alternatively, you could have given me a simple... [smiley=tonguin.gif] That would have been more apropos.

On the other hand, now I can give back a hearty... [smiley=cantcatch.gif]

;)

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by bgsgfan on Apr 11^th, 2004, 1:09am

Read my lips, NONE OF THE TESTS MEAN A DAMN THING IN THIS CASE.

Clarett has never been fast. Never, ever, never. Coming out of high school everyone wanted to know about his 40 times and all Tressell would say is that he never saw anyone catch him from behind (on the football field, in high school). At Ohio State, he was frequently caught from behind, after 20, 30, or 40 yard runs. These runs showed an incredible instinct for finding the hole, seeing the cutback, bowling people over with strength and leverage, as well as faking them out with quick bursts and changes of direction.

Besides his talent, Clarett has an obvious passion for the game. He played hurt. He cried when he got pulled from a game for fumbling. When on the sidelines, you could almost always find him standing beside the coach, totally into the game.

I don't like how he has handled himself off the field, but I can not forget how he plays: with talent, with passion. I could care less if he ran a 5.0 forty.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Feb 28^th, 2005, 1:18am

Clarett back suckin' it again. HOT from off "The REAL Feed":

Clarett messes up workout (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/football/nfl/wires/02/26/2020.ap.fbn.nfl.combine.clarett.0589/index.html)
SI.com: NFL (26.02.2005 21:42)

Who says this guy never gets it together in the NFL? Sadly, I think he has NFL-Europe and CFL written all over him. [smiley=shrug.gif]

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Feb 28^th, 2005, 10:14am

on 02/28/05 at 01:18:00, StegRock wrote:

Wow... what a fun thread...

Anyway, Clarett killed his chances at any NFL coin this weekend. He started off the weekend nicely with some good interviews (although some feel that he was almost reciting a script that his agent gave him when answering questions). Then the 40 came. OK, he ran some slow 40s. Like bgsgfan said at one point, the 40 time is nice, but not the end-all-be-all for an NFL player. But when Clarett refused to take part in the positional drills after posting two slow 40s, he dug his own grave. If I was an NFL owner, I would have considered using a late round draft pick on him prior to the Combine, but now I'd be hesitant to even sign him to an undrafted free agent deal.

He might as well just hop in his car and drive up to Montreal or Edmonton right now.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by Tony_O on Mar 3^rd, 2005, 1:11am

A great quote from one of the NFL scouts was, "If he quit during the combine drills, he will quit in the 4th quarter."

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by StegRock on Apr 2^nd, 2005, 12:44pm

Keepin' it in-house with this update (which is awesome). [smiley=thumbsup.gif] Check out the latest update on Clarett's latest workout on "the Gridiron Draft Guide":

http://home.comcast.net/~thegridiron/.

Title: Re: Clarett Finally Workouts for NFL Scouts!
Post by Philly on Apr 4^th, 2005, 9:15am

on 04/02/05 at 12:44:19, StegRock wrote:

Thanks for finding that interesting update, Steg! I love the author's appropriate use of cynicism and sarcasm in the report. ;)