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        the Gridiron >> between the 20's >>  Feedback on Jeff's article
        
(Message started by: BarnabyWilde on Jan 22nd, 2005, 11:49am)
Title: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by BarnabyWilde on Jan 22nd, 2005, 11:49am
Jeff-

Great article! I agree with almost all of what you said, except of course, for my Giants. There's no way the Giants take a runing back with their first pick (2nd round overall). They have way too many other holes to fill. I think they might be able to grab a FA from the many, many RB's available.

This is from Michael Eisen, who covers the Giants:

"Barber was at the very top of his game in 2004. He led the NFL in total yards and was selected to his first Pro Bowl. Based on that alone, I doubt the Giants are looking to add a top back this offseason. When you add in the fact that there are several other positions they want to improve, a feature back is well down on the priority list. Barber will slow down eventually. But in the just-concluded season, it seemed that his decline is anything but imminent. When it happens, hopefully, a few years down the road, the Giants will find another back. In the meantime, there are more pressing issues to address."
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by Philly on Jan 22nd, 2005, 2:18pm
I agree that the Giants have many other pressing needs, but with the depth of the RB pool this year, grabbing a prospect early and giving him time to play into the position while Tiki is still running strong makes a lot of sense.

They certainly won't go after one of the top FAs, but you think they'll grab a second tier guy (Mungro, Wells, etc.) to back Tiki up for the immediate future?
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by BarnabyWilde on Jan 22nd, 2005, 2:35pm
That is exactly what I think they'll do. I do not think they will use their top overall pick on a RB. A 4-5 round pick? Possibly, but not their 2nd rounder, unless they trade up into the first round somehow (there is a rumor floating about how the Giants want to trade Will Allen to the Cowboys for one of their #1s, but I don't see that happening)

If they can get a guy like Blaylock, Mungro, Wells, along that line, that would be a good move.
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by DirkDiggler on Jan 22nd, 2005, 7:23pm

on 01/22/05 at 14:18:07, Philly wrote:
I agree that the Giants have many other pressing needs, but with the depth of the RB pool this year, grabbing a prospect early and giving him time to play into the position while Tiki is still running strong makes a lot of sense.

They certainly won't go after one of the top FAs, but you think they'll grab a second tier guy (Mungro, Wells, etc.) to back Tiki up for the immediate future?


Don't the Giants have to use their first 3 picks on the offensive line?  Hell, they may want to use ALL of their picks on o-linemen hoping one of them is worthy of making the team.    ;D

On a more serious note.  Nice article.  I too agree with most of your takes.  However, the few I take exception to are:

Cincinnatti--Rudi will get franchised.  No way they let him go.

Green Bay--  Since Fisher and Davenport are both RFAs, I am not sure which one will stay.  I think they will keep Davenport and let Fisher go.  (Fisher by the way, has a great yards per carry)

Raiders will definitely not go with one of their current backs.  As you indicate, look for them to go draft or free agency.  (remember all the hype fargas got?  what a joke)

Chargers--  I agree with what you say.  Look for Chatman to emerge as a starter somewhere.

Great job!!
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by junkyardjake on Jan 22nd, 2005, 10:01pm
Very good runningback analysis Jeff, certainly for this stage of the off-season.

One thing I don't think is going to happen though, is Curtis Martin's continuation as a top-ten back.    Quite frankly, I hope the Jets trade him and keep Jordan, but either way, Hackett is gone as the Jets offensive coordinator, and Martin will be perhaps the most over-rated player in next season's fantasy drafts.
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by Philly on Jan 24th, 2005, 3:26pm

on 01/22/05 at 19:23:45, DirkDiggler wrote:
Don't the Giants have to use their first 3 picks on the offensive line?  Hell, they may want to use ALL of their picks on o-linemen hoping one of them is worthy of making the team.    ;D
The problem is that the OL depth in the 2005 draft isn't anything to get excited about.


Quote:
On a more serious note.  Nice article.  I too agree with most of your takes.  However, the few I take exception to are:

Cincinnatti--Rudi will get franchised.  No way they let him go.
Franchising him would be a smart move by the Bengals, but Rudi has already said that he will sit out before accepting that tag. ........link: http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050122/SPT02/501220388/1078/SPT
The Bengals need to sign him to a long-term deal, but with Perry (a first-rounder in 2004) also in the fold, it makes for a bit of a mess there, especially on a team that direly needs defensive help.


Quote:
Green Bay--  Since Fisher and Davenport are both RFAs, I am not sure which one will stay.  I think they will keep Davenport and let Fisher go.  (Fisher by the way, has a great yards per carry)
I think the Pack would be very happy to have Fisher around for another year (he is a better blocker and receiver than Davenport).  However, I think Davenport has more potential to be a feature back (a workhorse even) and teams will be willing to pay more for him in free agency.


Quote:
Raiders will definitely not go with one of their current backs.  As you indicate, look for them to go draft or free agency.  (remember all the hype fargas got?  what a joke)
The Raiders could have a big mess on their hands in the off-season.  They really need a young QB.  They need a RB.  If Porter flies camp, they'll need to think about a WR again.  Their defense needs help, especially since both their CBs are unhappy and want to leave.  They might be forced to try to ride one of the RBs they already have signed.


Quote:
Chargers--  I agree with what you say.  Look for Chatman to emerge as a starter somewhere.
I'm not sure I buy Chatman as a starter in the league, but he is a good #2 guy.  Maybe he's what Barnaby is looking for in NY?


Quote:
Great job!!
Thanks!  :)




[/quote]
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by Philly on Jan 24th, 2005, 3:32pm

on 01/22/05 at 22:01:44, junkyardjake wrote:
Very good runningback analysis Jeff, certainly for this stage of the off-season.

One thing I don't think is going to happen though, is Curtis Martin's continuation as a top-ten back.    Quite frankly, I hope the Jets trade him and keep Jordan, but either way, Hackett is gone as the Jets offensive coordinator, and Martin will be perhaps the most over-rated player in next season's fantasy drafts.
I wouldn't mind seeing all of my fantasy opponents taking Curtis Martin and Tiki Barber as the #1 and #2 overall fantasy picks.

I'm not sure what the trade market would be for Martin.  He's older than most teams would want for a starter - unless he agreed to a short-term deal (unlikely).  He'd demand too much money to be a #2.  It seems that the most likely scenario would be to keep Martin on the Jets and let Jordan walk while drafting a prospect.

The new Jets OC certainly doesn't mind running a back into the ground.  When he was with the Titans, he called Eddie George's number a lot.  I don't think Martin will be a top 10 back again, but he should get the chance.
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by DirkDiggler on Jan 24th, 2005, 3:53pm

Quote:
Green Bay--  Since Fisher and Davenport are both RFAs, I am not sure which one will stay.  I think they will keep Davenport and let Fisher go.  (Fisher by the way, has a great yards per carry)  
 

I think the Pack would be very happy to have Fisher around for another year (he is a better blocker and receiver than Davenport).  However, I think Davenport has more potential to be a feature back (a workhorse even) and teams will be willing to pay more for him in free agency.


We agree on the value of Davenport and Fisher.  However, I do think since Davenports value is higher, they will tender him as a much higher RFA.  I think they will tender him high enough that other teams won't touch him.  No way the Packers want to lose Davenport and not have a solid back up to Ahman Green.

I think Fisher would be a great fit for many teams.  I would love for the Eagles to sign him to replace Buckhalter who is free to go.   However, I do think he would be a great fit on MANY teams and he will be highly coveted as that  'relief' back.
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by junkyardjake on Jan 25th, 2005, 11:22am

Quote:
The new Jets OC certainly doesn't mind running a back into the ground.  When he was with the Titans, he called Eddie George's number a lot.  I don't think Martin will be a top 10 back again, but he should get the chance.


That may be true, but George averaged about 320 carries during his tenure, Martin had 370 this season.  I think the big difference though will be the TDs, where Martin had 14 (2 receiving).  That number might be cut in half, and I think Pennington becomes a great sleeper pick in 2005.  (Probably a sixth rounder).

All in all, there are probably 15 RBs I would consider before Martin next year, including Kevin Jones, and maybe even Tatum Bell if he secures the Denver spot.

One guy that will definitely be undervalued I think is Deuce McAllister, how do you feel about him next year?
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by Philly on Jan 25th, 2005, 1:07pm

on 01/25/05 at 11:22:30, junkyardjake wrote:
One guy that will definitely be undervalued I think is Deuce McAllister, how do you feel about him next year?

I've never really been a big Deuce guy, mainly because he doesn't score enough even when he is putting up big yardage totals.  But I think he will return to form next year and have 1400-1600 yards and 10-14 TDs.  He'll probably slide in fantasy drafts some, unlike this past year where he was being overvalued and taken as high as #1 overall.
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by sameoldsameold on Jan 25th, 2005, 3:09pm
duece would be a great back if they used him more....he isnt used right and enough in that offense....hasllet being rehired will dampen deuces stats again...also curtis martin is undervalued every year as well as jimmy smith saying they are too old....i see martin with one more good year in him.....10 TDs(total) 1300-1600 yards(total yards)...
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by DirkDiggler on Jan 29th, 2005, 3:38pm

Quote:


I think the Pack would be very happy to have Fisher around for another year (he is a better blocker and receiver than Davenport).  However, I think Davenport has more potential to be a feature back (a workhorse even) and teams will be willing to pay more for him in free agency.


Well...Fisher has resigned with the Packers for 1 year.  Thus he will be a free agent next year instead of the RFA he is now.  Smart signing by the Pack.
Title: Re: Feedback on Jeff's article
Post by StegRock on Apr 15th, 2005, 5:08pm
Boy, Philster, you may have really nailed it on the head with your "RB By Carload" piece, your last piece on the FF Articles page (http://www.fantasyfootballer.com/fantasyarticles.htm), at least in spirit.  Could this be a residual effect of the dynamic you were pointing out?

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft05/columns/story?columnist=mortensen_chris&id=2036181&CMP=OTC-DT9705204233&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl%2fdraft05%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumnist%3dmortensen_chris%26id%3d2036181%26CMP%3dOTC-DT9705204233.


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