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        the Gridiron >> between the 20's >>  Philly's Final 2006 Mock
        
(Message started by: Philly on Apr 26^th, 2006, 4:39pm)

Title: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by Philly on Apr 26^th, 2006, 4:39pm

Here it is... trades and all. Have fun with it.

1 49ERS - Reggie Bush RB USC - Niners move up and keep Reggie on the West Coast.
2 SAINTS - Mario Williams DE NC State - Saints stay put and grab next big thing at DE.
3 TITANS - Vince Young QB Texas - Owner overrules coaches and goes for upside.
4 RAIDERS - Matt Leinart QB USC - Leinart stays in SoCal and dons black and silver.
5 PACKERS - D'Brick Ferguson OT Virginia - Favre staying, needs some protection.
6 TEXANS - Winston Justice OT USC - Texans fill huge need for a LT to protect Carr.
7 JETS - Vernon Davis TE Maryland - Jets get a headliner for their offense.
8 BILLS - Haloti Ngata DT Oregon - Behemoth DT takes pressure off LBs, DBs.
9 LIONS - AJ Hawk LB Ohio St - Lions don't draft a WR, alert the presses!
10 VIKINGS - Jay Cutler QB Vanderbilt - Vikes need a young QB and move up to grab Cutler.
11 RAMS - Chad Greenway LB Iowa - Rams need a WLB in a bad way.
12 BROWNS - Manny Lawson LB NC State - Many say Wimbley, but Lawson has more upside.
13 RAVENS - Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida St - Interior presence should make Ray-Ray happy for a bit.
14 EAGLES - Chad Jackson WR Florida - I doubt it will happen, but he's the one I want.
15 BRONCOS - DeAngelo Williams RB Memphis - A better pick than Clarett in 2005.
16 DOLPHINS - Michael Huff DB Texas - Huff slides right into Saban's lap.
17 CARDINALS - Tye Hill CB Clemson - Speedy corner fits nicely opposite Rolle.
18 COWBOYS - Jimmy Williams S Virginia Tech - Dallas now has an impressive pair of Williamses.
19 CHARGERS - Santonio Holmes WR Ohio St - Chargers need Rivers to succeed with Brees parting.
20 CHIEFS - Tamba Hali DE Penn St - Versatile DE can stop the run and rush the passer.
21 PATRIOTS - Bobby Carpenter LB Ohio St - The next Vrabel helps an aging LB unit.
22 TEXANS - Eric Winston OT Miami - Texans now have a pair of Winstons as bookends.
23 BUCS - Marcus McNeill OT Auburn - Bucs need help at OT and grab a big one.
24 BENGALS - Nick Mangold C Ohio St - Bengals grab a long-term pivot.
25 GIANTS - Laurence Maroney RB Minnesota - Giants prepare for Tiki's decline (should it ever happen).
26 BEARS - Leonard Pope TE Georgia - Should help Rex and improve a shaky offense.
27 PANTHERS - LenDale White RB USC - Panthers hope to motivate this talented back.
28 JAGUARS - Ernie Sims LB Florida St - Athletic LB could be an immediate star.
29 JETS - Daryn Colledge OT Boise St - Jets need some youth and long-term potential at OT.
30 COLTS - Antonio Cromartie CB Florida St - Colts grab big-time playmaker for their secondary.
31 SEAHAWKS - Mathias Kiwanuka DE Boston College - He was a top ten pick early in the season…
32 STEELERS - Ko Simpson S South Carolina - Steelers now have an exciting young pair of safeties.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by bakes781 on Apr 26^th, 2006, 5:20pm

I love the trades! I don't know if the 49ers have enough to move up, but I like the idea. I've heard Hali's stock has really taken a dive & Cromartie's is skyrocketing.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by BarnabyWilde on Apr 26^th, 2006, 8:30pm

Not gonna happen. [smiley=no.gif]

I do think the Broncos move up to grab Davis though.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on Apr 26^th, 2006, 8:48pm

Ok, first, I really appreciate the efforts! I think its fantastic that we have someone on here who takes their time to share with us their mock draft and one that I might emphasize,
appears to have taken some time and great effort to construct!

Thanks Philster!

However, I thnik the Texans, trading away the BEST athlete in sports away in order to move down to REACH for 2 tackles,

is not their style. They are an organization that doesn't gamble too much when it comes down to draft time.

Both Justice and & Winston are REACHers at those spots.

in fact, you have Colledge being taken too high as well. If anyhting along the offensive line is going to be taken too early, I believe it will be the interior men : centers and guards; but, not tackles,

Thanks again Philly!

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by StegRock on Apr 26^th, 2006, 9:54pm

Nice job, Jeff... [smiley=thumbsup.gif] Surely some thought went into this...

Again, this is really not my forte, so it's not really for me to comment on, so I will only speak for my Broncos.

...Well,... actually,... given a second look,... and in light of the fact that I have always had a nose for assessing running backs, including with respect to the NFL Draft, I am going to comment on where you have them falling... because,... well,... I don't think you have one dead on.

First, my Broncos,... while I do think that Jim might have been on to something regarding the Ricky rumors, Ricky would make sense in the Broncos system, I strongly believe that they are NOT looking to a running back, at least not with their first pick overall, and if they were, I think it would be Maroney that they would take, not the 5'9" speedster Williams, and the comparison to Clarett is not well-founded on various levels. From what little I've seen, Maroney is the one who reminds me of T.D.

The rest...

Reggie will go first, but it will, anti-climactically, be to the Texans.

While I can see the Giants going tailback, with Tiki to mentor, it seems like Williams is a good fit there.

I do not see the Panthers going running back. Now, Maroney (or whomever) to the Jaguars right behind them, that makes some sense.

...

But,... hey,... I'm just giving a "macro" [smiley=threed.gif] perspective at this one position. I really don't know squat to any degree of detail when it comes to this. [smiley=shrug.gif]

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by StegRock on Apr 27^th, 2006, 1:11am

on 04/26/06 at 21:54:35, StegRock wrote:

First, my Broncos,... while I do think that Jim might have been on to something regarding the Ricky rumors, Ricky would make sense in the Broncos system, I strongly believe that they are NOT looking to a running back, at least not with their first pick overall, and if they were, I think it would be Maroney that they would take, not the 5'9" speedster Williams, and the comparison to Clarett is not well-founded on various levels. From what little I've seen, Maroney is the one who reminds me of T.D.

Just a philosophical point of clarification... Many of you may be aware that I have Ron Dayne in the GBRFL (http://www.fantasyfootballer.com/gbrfl/) and, in any event, have been a long-time Dayne apologist (as per http://www.fantasyfootballer.com/stegeman/dayne.htm). Remember, though,... it is NOT that I think the way I do now because I have him on my roster and plan to keep him; quite the contrary, it is because I think the way I do, that I have him on my roster and plan to keep him. Whether I am right or wrong is another issue. The point is the proof I proffer is in the pudding. It's not mere rhetoric, and that is an important distinction to make... in life in general. [smiley=wiseman.gif] [smiley=zenmaster.gif]

Anyway, moving right along...

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by Philly on Apr 27^th, 2006, 10:16am

The rumor du jour is that Reggie Bush is close to a contract agreement with the Texans. If that's the case, I have him slotted correctly, but with the wrong team now. If I were calling the shots in Houston, I would trade out of the #1 spot. There will be suitors. Houston has a number of needs, bookend tackles at the top of the list. As amazing as Bush is, the Texans don't need him.

Projecting RBs is fairly difficult this year. I think that Williams will go before Maroney. (A scout I've talked to says that Williams reminds him a lot of a guy named Tomlinson who plays in the NFL already.) I like Maroney and see him going in the 20s somewhere. I think it's not impossible that White slides to the end of the first (or out of it completely) despite the fact that he's an obvious talent.

Offensive line is another difficult one to project. Last fall, many were excited at just how deep this draft was going to be--specifically at interior line--but also at tackle. Some of those tackles seem to have dropped (with the exception of D'Brick and Justice). Daryn Colledge is a Matt Light/Matt Lepsis type who will excel in pass-pro initially and need to grow some to be more effective as a run blocker. He handled Mathias Kiwanuka without trouble when he faced him in the bowl game this year. He's handled everyone he's faced so far. I think he's this year's Logan Mankins. Just a hunch on my part. On the interior, only Mangold and (maybe) Jean-Gilles are first round possibilities at this point.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by StegRock on Apr 27^th, 2006, 3:16pm

Please understand that what I am going to say here comes from the philosopher in me...

on 04/27/06 at 10:16:22, Philly wrote:

I could not AGREE with you more. I think they are in an AWESOME position to really capitalize and work to make their team better overall by working on other aspects of their team like o-line. I would even go as far as to say that Bush's going to Houston could end up being terrible for both Bush and the Texans. I could see his career getting stunted, the Texans continuing to flounder, which would put David Carr's career in jeopardy, and Domanick Davis's once bright future getting ruined. [smiley=no.gif] What a potential mess...

Anyway, the (potential) problem (I see) with your analysis is that I wonder how much your list represents what you think should happen (even if you are right), especially since you do it right off the bat, probably incorrectly as is apparently coming to bear in that case.

Anyway, you do find support for your speculation that the Panthers will go running back if given the opportunity in The Sports Network's mock draft which I posted on the "General Draft Discussion" thread here "between the 20's". For whatever reason, I just see it oppositely. They just extended Foster's contract. They just last year took Eric Shelton who is chomping at the bit for his opportunity. Nick Goings is a decent back, and they have Brad Hoover, who's shown he can get the job done in a pinch, in the wings. I just can't believe they don't have greater needs. To bring this around full-circle, it seems like if they go running back, at least in Round 1, they'd be making a mistake similar/analogous to the one we both see the Texans making as discussed above. [smiley=shrug.gif]

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on Apr 27^th, 2006, 9:15pm

on 04/27/06 at 10:16:22, Philly wrote:

I couldn't DISAGREE with you AND anyone else who aspires to THIS philosophy anymore than I have ever disagreed with anyone on anything.

Bush can make ANY TEAM's OLINE better WITHOUT adding talent.

See LT2 & the San Diego Chargers for THAT specific NFL example.

He is a once in a lifetime player. You just don't throw talent around like this to pick up other players who can be taken in later rounds.

Talk about Texans needing more than ONE player to fill needs.

BUSH would be the BEST WR in this draft. He'd be a TOP 5 PICK as WIDE RECEIVER in this draft.

Thats 2 positions : RB & WR.

Now theres RS - return specialist.

And, he could punt.

Thats 3 positions filled with taking ONE player. (emergency punter makes 4)

Case closed.

Quote:

Projecting RBs is fairly difficult this year. I think that Williams will go before Maroney. (A scout I've talked to says that Williams reminds him a lot of a guy named Tomlinson who plays in the NFL already.) I like Maroney and see him going in the 20s somewhere. I think it's not impossible that White slides to the end of the first (or out of it completely) despite the fact that he's an obvious talent.

Maroney can block. DeAngelo hasn't really shown that. RBs that can NOT block in the NFL

wind up as 3rd down backs.

Besides, lets give credit wher credit is due here. If you really believe that comparison to LT2 then, lets shine some light on JYJ who LONG AGO mentioned that same sentence in conjunction w/ DeAngelo Williams -

Anyhow, I truly enjoy changing wits with you Philly,

keep up the great work! [smiley=twothumbsup.gif]

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by Philly on Apr 28^th, 2006, 4:30pm

I don't deny that earlier this offseason I had DeAngelo Williams rated below Laurence Maroney and argued as much with JYJ. However, from what I recall, I went back and watched some tape of each one and changed my tune.

Saying Maroney can block and Williams can't is interesting. Williams wasn't asked to block much (very few RBs in college are), but he showed good effort and decent technique at the Senior Bowl during the drills. Maroney didn't jump out at me as being even a decent blocking back, although the effort is certainly there. The only first round back that IS a good blocker is Joseph Addai. He was injured much of the year and still played (despite not running the ball much) because of his blocking abilities. I see him sneaking into the first round now.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by Philly on Apr 28^th, 2006, 4:31pm

And with that... here's my REAL final mock draft. I didn't include trades in this one because I suck at predicting trades.

1 TEXANS - Reggie Bush RB USC
2 SAINTS - D'Brick Ferguson OT Virginia
3 TITANS - Matt Leinart QB USC
4 JETS - Mario Williams DE NC State
5 PACKERS - AJ Hawk LB Ohio St
6 49ERS - Vernon Davis TE Maryland
7 RAIDERS - Vince Young QB Texas
8 BILLS - Haloti Ngata DT Oregon
9 LIONS - Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida St
10 CARDINALS - Jay Cutler QB Vanderbilt
11 RAMS - Michael Huff DB Texas
12 BROWNS - Kam Wimbley LB Florida St
13 RAVENS - Chad Greenway LB Iowa
14 EAGLES - Winston Justice OT USC
15 BRONCOS - Chad Jackson WR Florida
16 DOLPHINS - Antonio Cromartie CB Florida St
17 VIKINGS - Ernie Sims LB Florida St
18 COWBOYS - Jimmy Williams S Virginia Tech
19 CHARGERS - Tye Hill CB Clemson
20 CHIEFS - Santonio Holmes WR Ohio St
21 PATRIOTS - Bobby Carpenter LB Ohio St
22 49ERS - Jason Allen S Tennessee
23 BUCS - Johnathan Joseph CB South Carolina
24 BENGALS - Richard Marshall CB Fresno St
25 GIANTS - DeAngelo Williams RB Memphis
26 BEARS - Ko Simpson S South Carolina
27 PANTHERS - Manny Lawson LB NC State
28 JAGUARS - Laurence Maroney RB Minnesota
29 JETS - Marcedes Lewis TE UCLA
30 COLTS - Joseph Addai RB LSU
31 SEAHAWKS - Ashton Youboty CB Ohio St
32 STEELERS - LenDale White RB USC

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by BarnabyWilde on Apr 28^th, 2006, 4:35pm

I'll wear an Eagles shirt on Sundays if the Giants draft a running back in the first round. No way that happens. Otherwise, looks real good Philly!

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by bakes781 on Apr 28^th, 2006, 4:44pm

on 04/28/06 at 16:35:40, BarnabyWilde wrote:

I'll wear an Eagles shirt on Sundays if the Giants draft a running back in the first round. No way that happens. Otherwise, looks real good Philly!

lol you can have my Irving Fryar reversible. ;)

Pat's still have Vrabel. What they need is McGinest's replacement. The answer Kamerion Wimbley or Manny Lawson.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on Apr 28^th, 2006, 6:08pm

on 04/28/06 at 16:30:06, Philly wrote:

The only first round back that IS a good blocker is Joseph Addai.

Try LenDale White on for size. I believe he will be able to do just about anything.

Also, Reggie Bush (Let me stretch his position fulfillment - he could also play Center! MUhahwhwhw). Though it's his worst attribute, still, his worst attribute is really,

not that bad.

All it basically takes in order to block as a RB in the NFL is attitude. DeAngelo Williams doesn't like to be touched. I am not sure he'll be a servicable blocker ?.?.?

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by StegRock on Apr 29^th, 2006, 12:43am

on 04/27/06 at 21:15:46, KillerKingSting wrote:

Talk about Texans needing more than ONE player to fill needs.

BUSH would be the BEST WR in this draft. He'd be a TOP 5 PICK as WIDE RECEIVER in this draft.

Thats 2 positions : RB & WR.

Now theres RS - return specialist.

And, he could punt.

Thats 3 positions filled with taking ONE player. (emergency punter makes 4)

Case closed.

Case closed based on that... While you are, of course, free to disagree with the take (it's not really a hill I'm willing to die on, mind you), I fail to see how this line of reasoning above gets you anywhere. It has no bearing on the reality of the matter. Bush will play running back in the NFL. That's that. He has no positional value outside that. Return specialist,... YIKES! Actually, it is, in a way, the flip-side that bears a closer resemblance to reality... His being the talent that he is is precisely the reason why he will NOT have any value as a return man as there is NO WAY they'd risk his getting injured returning punts or kickoffs. ... Anyway, besides that, the one crucial position I do not see listed is offensive lineman, but that would cause a recursive loop as it is he himself who he would need to block for. ;) Of course, we now know this all to be moot... :-X

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on May 1^st, 2006, 7:13pm

on 04/29/06 at 00:43:24, StegRock wrote:

Why wouldn't it get me anywhere? because the Texans failed to draft the best player available in the draft?

Nah [smiley=no.gif]

Quote:

It has no bearing on the reality of the matter. Bush will play running back in the NFL. That's that.

Wow. For someone who claims to think "outside" the box - this is NOT a reflection of that particular virtue.

Wrong again. He'll be much more than a RB. Coaches, GMs, Talent evaluators, Scouts, former players turned Media men - all know and advertise this.

Quote:

He has no positional value outside that. Return specialist,... YIKES! Actually, it is, in a way, the flip-side that bears a closer resemblance to reality... His being the talent that he is is precisely the reason why he will NOT have any value as a return man as there is NO WAY they'd risk his getting injured returning punts or kickoffs.

I could use your philosophy against you. Putting Bush in as a fulltime back - could certainly cause him more propensity for injury than RS.

He'll be a return specialist - a running back - a wide receiver.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by StegRock on May 2^nd, 2006, 3:00am

on 05/01/06 at 19:13:05, KillerKingSting wrote:

Why wouldn't it get me anywhere? because the Texans failed to draft the best player available in the draft?

Nah [smiley=no.gif]

?.?.?

Quote:

In the long, we'll see how the percentage breakdowns pan out... I think it will definitely be closer to 1%, 98%, 1% than to 33%, 34%, 33%, respectively.

As for using my reasoning against me,... you must remember the idea behind my reasoning is that he'd be put in unnecessary extra harm's way. If he's a full-time tailback, which is what he will be (in the end, at least), that's his role. Anything else amounts to unnecessary extra exposure, especially if it's in the return game, where we all know it's akin to running the gaunlet. Punt returning, in particular, is a nightmare. [smiley=scared.gif]

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by Philly on May 2^nd, 2006, 1:54pm

on 04/28/06 at 18:08:00, KillerKingSting wrote:

Try LenDale White on for size. I believe he will be able to do just about anything.

I didn't include him because I didn't think he was a first-round back any more. Looks like the NFL agreed.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on May 2^nd, 2006, 2:23pm

on 05/02/06 at 13:54:24, Philly wrote:

I didn't include him because I didn't think he was a first-round back any more. Looks like the NFL agreed.

BIG mistake on the NFL's part. ;)

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by Philly on May 3^rd, 2006, 2:04pm

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on May 3^rd, 2006, 2:39pm

What?????? [smiley=laugh.gif]

Your serious?

The 246th pick overall?

Ganther - hes the heir apparent to LenDale?

The guy was drafted in the 7th round (I thought he was worth a 6th rounder),

and lets be honest here,

7th rounders are drafted for special team purposes. [smiley=yes.gif]

As a BACK-UP to lenDale - ok - as a special teamer - ok,

but certainly not a fail-safe plan to LenDale.

No way. [smiley=no.gif]

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by BarnabyWilde on May 3^rd, 2006, 11:16pm

Read this Stinger:

http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/viewArticle.asp?articleID=1107

There are some players who had nice NFL careers who were drafted in the 7th round (or later):

Shannon Sharpe-7th round
Ernest Byner-10th round
Karl Mecklenberg- 12th round
Mark Clayton-8th round

And a few 6th rounders have had or are having nice careers, guys like Terrell Davis, oh yeah, and some guy names Tom Brady. :)

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on May 3^rd, 2006, 11:34pm

ok,
just so I got this straight here,

both Barn-a-bee and Philly are saying that,

of all the VERY FEW and FAR inBEEtween players that were NEEDLES in the hay stack in later rounds of the draft,

Ganther is going to be one of those (as compared to Brady??) players,

right?

BEEcause otherwise,

Philly's reasoning for the Titans drafting Ganther was primarily for the fail-safe plan of taking over LenDale's production,,,,,,

feel free to set this BEE in the righteous DIrection [smiley=lost.gif]

:D

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on May 4^th, 2006, 6:39am

on 05/03/06 at 23:16:49, BarnabyWilde wrote:

By the way, superb article on the importance of the later rounds of the NFL draft. [smiley=bow.gif]

There are a couple of guys in my league, specifically speaking, Duke [smiley=dunce.gif] and Tux [smiley=Imwithstupid.gif], who REALLY NEED to READ this article.

As they believe that, past the 2nd or 3rd round of our rookie draft, that being approx. 30 picks/players, are useless.

Tremendous article. Thank you Barn-a-bee! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by Philly on May 5^th, 2006, 4:40pm

I'm not saying that Quinton Ganther has anywhere near the talent that LenDale White has, but he is a back-up plan. If LenDale White can't get it together (I think he WILL get it together, by the way) then they have another big back to share carries with Chris Brown if need be.

Title: Re: Philly's Final 2006 Mock
Post by KillerKingSting on May 6^th, 2006, 6:13pm

on 05/03/06 at 14:04:30, Philly wrote:

Talent-wise, yes... If he can grow up and take his job seriously then he'll be a real steal where he was taken. But let's face it, even Tennessee isn't sure about him. Look at the RB they took later on... Quinton Ganther. He's another big bruising back (severly underrated, in my opinion) in the same mold.

I'm not saying that Quinton Ganther has anywhere near the talent that LenDale White has, but he is a back-up plan. If LenDale White can't get it together (I think he WILL get it together, by the way) then they have another big back to share carries with Chris Brown if need be.

Ok, fair enough BUT,

I am saying that IF Tennessee was as worried about LenDale's potential FAILURE as it SEEMS (quote "But let's face it, even Tennessee isn't sure about him. Look at the RB they took later on... Quinton Ganther." un-quote)...............

that you were pointing towards,
I think they would have spent a pick higher than the 7th round (again - special team player alert! [smiley=yes.gif]) on a back.

Just my opinion,

however, playing devil's advocate against myselfish here,

there might not have been a bigger back worth drafting earlier than the 7th round either,

and if thats the case,

again,

I find it difficult to believe that TENN. is THAT concerned about the potential success of LenDale White as compared to Quin-Ganther.