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        the Gridiron >> the Sidelines >>  The Heisman
        
(Message started by: Razzak on Nov 25^th, 2002, 2:14pm)

Title: The Heisman
Post by Razzak on Nov 25^th, 2002, 2:14pm

No west coast player has won the Heisman since Marcus Allen in 1981. 21 YEARS. You'd think the Pac-10, the most offensive conference in the nation with some of the best QB's and WR's that have gone to the NCAA and NFL would have gotten one in that time span.

No, the national media's east coast bias cannot be denied now. 21 years is absolutely ridiculous. If Carson Palmer, who has been flawless all year long, does not win the Heisman, the Pac-10 and Rose Bowl should withdraw from the Fiesta Bowl. Personally, the "national championship" in college football is a joke now with so many different competitive schools that without a playoff system it's worthless.

But, I've watched Dorsey and Carson. I have only seen Leftwich twice so I can't really comment on him. I saw Banks four times and really wasn't that impressed. Carson is twice the quarterback Dorsey is. He's looked spectacular in every game, and every game he has multiple passes dropped. People say he didn't do well vs. Kansas State (USC loss). Actually, he was pretty solid. Poor play-calling and 6 (six!) dropped passes by Freshman Mike Williams cost the game. Oh yeah, Kelly dropped two and Colbert dropped one as well. Even when he has a good game his receivers let him down. USC beat UCLA 52-21 (Was 52-7 until final two minutes) and he had four touchdown passes dropped (2 williams, 1 colbert, 1 kelly). Yes, that number was almost in the 70's.

The receivers straight up cannot catch, and Carson threw one errant pass (low at McKenzie's feet) all day long. Carson is the best player in the nation and is on a competitive team. Hell, they are one missed extra point vs. WSU at the end of regulation (and two missed fg's earlier in the game) away from being the #3 team, and if they beat Notre Dame they'll probably be the #5 team in the nation.

If USC beats Notre Dame and Carson doesn't get the Heisman there's something seriously wrong. He's got the single-season numbers to make a claim for it. He's got the career numbers to make a claim for it (just set Pac-10 passing record). He's got a very competitive team.

His only knock is that he's got a bright NFL future, and the Heismann normally goes to players who don't (funny, isn't that?). Anyways, if this guy ends up on the Bears next year, watch out. I just pray he doesn't go to the Bengals.

Carson: Has the team. Has the single season numbers. Has the career numbers. He is undoubtedly the offensive player on the team that is indispensible, and plays well for full games versus REAL opponents. None of this being tied with Rutgers at the half bs. He's not on the east coast.

End rant.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Philly on Nov 25^th, 2002, 4:59pm

East Coast bias continues. Larry Johnson wins the Heisman this year.

[smiley=sneaky.gif]

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Razzak on Nov 25^th, 2002, 5:01pm

on 11/25/02 at 16:59:25, Philly wrote:

East Coast bias continues. Larry Johnson wins the Heisman this year.

[smiley=sneaky.gif]

My guess is Dorsey if Miami wins out, Johnson if they don't.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Philly on Nov 25^th, 2002, 8:00pm

I think you're right though. Palmer will be the studliest of the big-name QBs to come out.
[smiley=thinking.gif]

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Razzak on Nov 26^th, 2002, 2:13pm

USC: 6th in the nation.
Notre Dame: 7th in the nation.

USC Favored by 10 1/2 points.

Whoever plays us in a Bowl game is gonna get whooped. The sad part: USC won't play in the Fiesta or the Rose this year.

Now what would you rather see, Miami and SC duke it out or Miami roll over a pathetic Big-10 team. Can we please make the Big-10 a mid-major? Final Score: Miami 56, OSU 10.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Philly on Nov 26^th, 2002, 3:18pm

Miami is not as good as advertised. The problem is that they aren't playing anyone good.

I don't like any of the Florida teams, so I don't care who beats them - as long as Miami does not end up #1.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Philly on Nov 26^th, 2002, 3:22pm

on 11/25/02 at 14:14:22, Razzak wrote:

None of this being tied with Rutgers at the half bs.

Just for clarification, Rutgers still had the lead on Miami into the third quarter. Let's not trash my alma mater.

[smiley=hellyeafunny.gif]

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Razzak on Nov 26^th, 2002, 3:30pm

on 11/26/02 at 15:22:06, Philly wrote:

Just for clarification, Rutgers still had the lead on Miami into the third quarter. Let's not trash my alma mater.

[smiley=hellyeafunny.gif]

hehe... :D

It's just frustrating that USC has played a top 25 team every single week. yes, every team they've played has been top 25 at one point (except Stanford). 4 of them have been top 10 as well (WSU, Colorado, Oregon, Kansas State) and soon to play another team that is top 10 in ND.

Aside from Stanford, there wasn't a single pushover team on the schedule while the east coast gets to play teams like Connecticut, Vanderbilt, and Rutgers. Strength of schedule really don't mean anything when teams like OSU who didn't play a single good team get into the national championship.

I know they went undefeated... but its the big-10, and the only other decent team in the big-10 they didn't even play.

By the way. I think Rutgers played'em great that game, but they just didn't have the speed or confidence to keep up in the 4th.

Too bad Miami/Oklahoma won't lose. USC needs losses by both and a win over ND and they *might* slip into a national championship :D That is, if they can convince the pollsters they're a top two team.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by BarnabyWilde on Dec 1^st, 2002, 12:44am

Palmer made a case for the Heisman and for his Trojans for the BCS today.....425 yards and 4 td's...WOW! :o

He should get an invitation at least for the ceremony, don't you think?

Now if only my beloved [smiley=turkey.gif] [smiley=turkey.gif] from VaTech can pull off an upset over those hated Canes...not likely though.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Razzak on Dec 1^st, 2002, 1:22am

on 12/01/02 at 00:44:55, BarnabyWilde wrote:

Now if only my beloved [smiley=turkey.gif] [smiley=turkey.gif] from VaTech can pull off an upset over those hated Canes...not likely though.

More likely than you think. Honestly, who has Miami beaten? If VTech's D shows up they have a chance. Let's see what Dorsey/McGahee do vs. a non high school team.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Philly on Dec 4^th, 2002, 10:42am

There would be nothing better than a Miami loss! Hate those Canes! [smiley=coach.gif]

I think the Heisman comes down to Johnson vs. Palmer. I'm pulling for Johnson because I love JoePa. I think Palmer has certainly caught the eyes of many voters.

I don't think Dorsey has a chance even with a stellar game and win against the Gobblers.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Philly on Dec 13^th, 2002, 11:21pm

OK... now that we're a day away...

Johnson has very nice numbers. Unfortunately some of those numbers came against some weaker Big-10 opponents. Therefore, he finishes 2nd.

The Heisman goes to....

Carson Palmer.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Razzak on Dec 14^th, 2002, 12:12am

on 12/13/02 at 23:21:46, Philly wrote:

It'll be nice to see a guy win the Heisman with a chance to do well in the Pros. Aside from George and Woodson, I can't think of any since Allen in 81. Then again, those mid-late 80's are a little hazy :) I know there's a couple more. Who else?

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by BarnabyWilde on Dec 14^th, 2002, 9:05pm

Close race, but Palmer pulls it out. What do you all think? Did it go to the right person?

I think it did.

Title: Re: The Heisman
Post by Razzak on Dec 14^th, 2002, 9:32pm

Of course *I* do :)