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Topic: Browns - William Green Thread (Read 427 times) |
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Philosopher King
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Re: Browns - Green Suspended/Davis Promoted
« Reply #7 on: Nov 12th, 2003, 1:02am » |
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on Nov 11th, 2003, 5:43pm, DirkDiggler wrote:Not double standard at all .
Anderson tested positive for drugs. His SECOND TIME. He was found guilty by the league.
Willie Green was NOT found guilty. He was found in leery circumstances, but not legally guilty. |
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Well, possession of an illegal drug and drunk driving are against the law, and I did say, "double-standardish." Putting yourself in leery circumstances usually leads to finding yourself in bad circumstances. Maybe if someone had the balls to suspend that running back whatever his first name is Smith back with the Bengals, he would not have cost them that Super Bowl. It's like Buddy Ryan's having the balls to show Cris Carter the tough love he needed and cutting his ass. Look at the direction Cris Carter went in after that. It's just that this kid-glove act of splitting hairs and justifying gets these guys nowhere, substantively, except out of trouble this time and making them feel like they weren't wrong, which just feeds that ego EVEN MORE. Look, don't get me wrong. The marijuana debate is another issue. I for one think it should be treated in our society like alcohol as I have stated before. But, it isn't. That's the reality. But, in any case, just hypothetically substitute cocaine or heroin in, as my point is one of principle, not minutiae. These guys make big bucks and they need to stop whining when they get caught or behave childishly. They need to learn accountability and, well, grow up. The NFLPA is starting to remind me of the ACLU.
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Philosopher King
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Re: Browns - Green Suspended/Davis Promoted
« Reply #9 on: Nov 12th, 2003, 12:58pm » |
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Philly, I grok what you're sayin'. And, I don't know the details of all this... But, can't a team suspend a player for whatever they want? And, wouldn't illegal drug possession and driving under the influence fall under the category of whatever they want? Teams can cut players however they want; they surely should be able to suspend them, a lesser punishment, so to speak, however they want. I mean players, ultimately, are employees.
In any event, what does it mean to say that "the Browns violated the collective bargaining agreement by suspending Green"? What stipulation of that agreement did they violate, the one that says "you have to let us play, and moreover pay us to play, until we are too high and incapacitated and just can't play"? Or, like everything anymore, is this just a loophole thing? Whether or not Butch Davis and the Browns followed precise procedure or not, I don't know. But, I commend them, in this morally castrated America we live in today, for taking some sort of stand and trying to make a statement to this guy to get on the right track, moreover, before he goes off track, which, I digress, will cause him to never get on track or, I digress again, untracked, a word the usage of which I still am not sure I totally get. 
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Re: Browns - Green Suspended/Davis Promoted
« Reply #10 on: Nov 12th, 2003, 1:18pm » |
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on Nov 12th, 2003, 12:58pm, StegRock wrote:Philly, I grok what you're sayin'. And, I don't know the details of all this... But, can't a team suspend a player for whatever they want?
And, wouldn't illegal drug possession and driving under the influence fall under the category of whatever they want? |
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I don't have a copy of the CBA in front of me, so this is just speculation... If Green is charged AND convicted of the offense, then the NFL has specific guidelines to follow regarding suspensions, testing, treatment, etc. I think the Browns suspension of Green (can we get any more colorful?) could place him in a double-jeopardy situation.
Quote:| Teams can cut players however they want; they surely should be able to suspend them, a lesser punishment, so to speak, however they want. I mean players, ultimately, are employees. |
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Employees that have a union and employees (with employers) who have agreed to work within the guidelines of the CBA, a document both parties have agreed to. (Furthermore, a document which is certainly more favorable to the owners than the players, based on similar agreements in other sports.)
Quote:| In any event, what does it mean to say that "the Browns violated the collective bargaining agreement by suspending Green"? What stipulation of that agreement did they violate, the one that says "you have to let us play, and moreover pay us to play, until we are too high and incapacitated and just can't play"? Or, like everything anymore, is this just a loophole thing? Whether or not Butch Davis and the Browns followed precise procedure or not, I don't know. But, I commend them, in this morally castrated America we live in today, for taking some sort of stand and trying to make a statement to this guy to get on the right track, moreover, before he goes off track, which, I digress, will cause him to never get on track or, I digress again, untracked, a word the usage of which I still am not sure I totally get. |
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I fully agree that morally they did the right thing, but ethically, they probably are in some hot water because the teams agreed to a procedure that they are choosing not to follow now?
Also, I too have always wondered about the track... Basically, a player who needs to get back "on track" is the same as a player who needs to get "untracked"??? I don't quite get untracked, so I don't use it.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 12th, 2003, 1:19pm by Philly » |
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Re: Browns - Green Suspended/Davis Promoted
« Reply #12 on: Nov 13th, 2003, 8:02am » |
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on Nov 13th, 2003, 2:20am, StegRock wrote:Well, back to the real topic here... How about this tidbit from "The REAL Feed"? ...
Browns RB Green's status uncertain
NFL.com (12.11.2003 23:08)
Running back William Green was suspended for Cleveland's game in Week 10, and Browns coach Butch Davis refused to say if he would play in Week 11.
Boy o' boy, huh? |
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OK, Butch Davis is a fantasy players nightmare. Unbelievable. I wish he would get fired and go back to the college ranks.
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"Every rule has an exception....the exception can't become the rule"
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Re: Browns - William Green Thread
« Reply #18 on: Nov 19th, 2003, 5:27pm » |
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on Nov 19th, 2003, 5:14pm, DirkDiggler wrote:
I don't think Suggs will see much action this year. Everything I have read says the Browns are impressed with James Jackson. He did not have the greatest yards per carry this past week, but they like his ability to find the goalline. But I guess only time will tell. |
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I should have put that caveat on the post. I don't see his stock rising this year as I think the Browns will be content to ride James Jackson until game 16, but I imagine Suggs will grab some carries here and there.
Ultimately, Suggs could be THE guy next year in Brownie land. Jackson has been in Cleveland for more than a couple years and hasn't been able to hold the starting job. I like Jackson, but who knows what Butch Davis is thinking.
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Philosopher King
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Re: Browns - William Green Thread
« Reply #22 on: Nov 22nd, 2003, 2:29pm » |
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As Willie's World Turns... Here's the LATEST on "The REAL Feed":
Pot found in Green home
ESPN: NFL (22.11.2003 12:08)
Police find marijuana, steak knife WESTLAKE, Ohio -- Police found a steak knife stuck in a kitchen cabinet and marijuana while searching the home of Cleveland Browns running back William Green, whose fiancee has been accused of stabbing him in the back. Green, currently suspended by the NFL for violating the league's substance abuse program, was hospitalized Wednesday after being cut in his home. Asia Gray, Green's girlfriend since high school and the mother of his two daughters, is charged with felonious...
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Philosopher King
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Re: Browns - William Green Thread
« Reply #23 on: Dec 2nd, 2003, 1:55pm » |
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I never was sold on this guy and now this...
... The latest from "The REAL Feed" on this guy's worsening situation:
Green's future with Browns remains in doubt
ESPN: NFL (01.12.2003 19:26)
RB does not return after suspension BEREA, Ohio -- Suspended running back William Green did not return to the Cleveland Browns on Monday, further clouding his future with the team. Green was banned by the NFL for four games on Nov. 13 for violating the league's substance abuse program. The 23-year-old was eligible to rejoin the Browns on Monday. However, the second-year back, whose fiancee has been accused of stabbing him in the back, was not at the club's training facility. The Browns said they were awaiting...
Here is ALL the local corroboration from "the Gridiron Newsstand":
http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news_room/news/arts/2419.0.html;
http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/sports/football/nfl/cleveland_browns/739302 0.htm;
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/10703 61192184140.xml;
http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=10598864&BRD=1699&PAG= 461&dept_id=46370&rfi=6.
Does this guy even have a future?  I am starting to think not, especially from a fantasy football perspective.
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| « Last Edit: Dec 2nd, 2003, 2:11pm by Stegfucius » |
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Wm Green suspended after arrest. 
Great news for those who have held on to Davis... 
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